maybe a military section

[ntcmpjg]

I just thought I would throw it out their for alan.

[IPD]

Not that I don't support our military, but I think things like this work out being posted in the chatter sections. There is no need to go overboard with OT (ie non car related) sub forums.

not only that, but i'm not serving against my will. i made a conscious choice to do what i do. i don't deserve any more of a "pat on the back" than you do for going about your respective job. i appreciate the support, but i don't see it as requisite...unlike some other people. at least this way, i can make a decent living while providing a "public service". i made 1/3 the money and had ZERO kudos when i was a different type of public servant in a previous occupation. out of deference to that profession, i don't feel it's fair to laud the military any more than you would for, say, postal carriers.

[ntcmpjg]

not only that, but i'm not serving against my will. i made a conscious choice to do what i do. i don't deserve any more of a "pat on the back" than you do for going about your respective job. i appreciate the support, but i don't see it as requisite...unlike some other people. at least this way, i can make a decent living while providing a "public service". i made 1/3 the money and had ZERO kudos when i was a different type of public servant in a previous occupation. out of deference to that profession, i don't feel it's fair to laud the military any more than you would for, say, postal carriers.

ok before it gets to far off track, I volunteered but the little pay I get isn't anything compared to what im risking. A postal person wont spend 12-15 months in a country that hates you and trys everyday to kill you. i'm just saying most guys over here dont get very much mail it helps you calm down at the end of a busy day doing god knows what to think someone cares to send someone a couple old magazines they were going to throw away.

[IPD]

if it's nothing compared to the risk...why accept the risk?

everyone has personal reasons for serving in the military. if accolades from countrymen is yours--you should abdicate your job at the soonest LEGALLY available opportunity.

[Vantage]

^^your an officer, your pay is not admissible into the argument.

[IPD]

^^your an officer, your pay is not admissible into the argument.

nice input. so my income level nullifies my argument...is that what you're trying to say? you might as well decree that anyone who makes over $50,000 can't vote while you're at it.

everyone has a price. everyone is willing to do anything for a price which is relative to the individual and his/her respective values. succinctly, everyone is a whore. this crosses all cultures.

if you have a problem with how much you make, then it's a personal problem. if you have a problem with how much i make, that's also a personal problem. EVERYONE in the armed forces has made a conscious decision about the work they do vs. the compensation they receive. EVERYONE. if you're unhappy with the compensation you receive for the work you do...then quit. that's not a military truism; it's a UNIVERSAL TRUISM. a job is a job. just because mine takes me away from my family and puts me in harm's way doesn't mean that i'm entitled to undue adulation for fulfilling the duties of my job.

for the record, i don't sing the praises of the police either. that's a job that one OPTS into; just like the military. no one is holding your family at gunpoint to coerce your obedience. mandatory conscription hasn't existed for decades. if you WERE drafted and served well (though unwillingly) then my hat is off to you. you, however, are not one of those people. you choose to serve. voluntarily. that means you have no right to complain about your own compensation.

for the record, when i entered DEP, i was NOT an officer candidate select. i was actually slated for an enlisted career field--and i even had a departure date for boot camp. the service decided it wanted me as an officer; not me. it wasn't a "hey, if i can't be an officer, i'm not going to play ball". i was going--either way. period. unlike prior-e's (which i have the utmost respect for) i didn't get CLEP'd on college credits. i put in 4 years, full time, the hard way (no TUI, no embry, etc). unlike rotc & academy pipeliners--i paid for my own education. i had $16,000 in loans to prove it. and i didn't get ANY of it repaid when i joined. i got NO signing bonus.

so please, continue to hate me for excelling to the level i'm currently at. unlike corporate business heads & professional sports players (which i'm sure you LOVE to adore), i'm actually tasked with a responsibility level commensurate with my compensation. in my job, if i f**k up, i'm going to jail for the rest of my life (if i'm not executed). i'm not asking for empathy. i'm not even asking for accolades. all i ask is that those i interact with are mature enough not to use something childish and pedantic--such as income level--in an attempt to nullify and disregard everything i say as irrelevant.

[Vantage]

i was being facetious. i didnt think you would actually take me seriously, but apparently its a sensitive subject for you. my apologies

[Vince86]

If you aint infantry you aint shit! hahah jk jk im not infantry anymore did my 6 years and combat tours in iraq, few rockets, rpgs and small arms encounters but made it home each time none the less and didnt sign back up when my contract ended. I do got to say though when I joined I had no idea it was going to be the way it was and for that I feel the pay wasnt measurable to my performance. one thing I did hate however was the REMF's/pogue's/fobbit's that would sit on base doing their jobs (which are important too) complain about how bad they have it and how hard their life is eating at the chow hall every meal, getting at least 8 hours of sleep every night and how cold the A/C gets. This of course was something we all heard every couple of days. I just love it though, cause I think "man I'm glad I dont have it that bad HAHAHAHA!" then the daydream stops and its all about shouting showing shoving shooting to disable and shooting to kill all over again.

Thats really the main problem I had was people who dont realize how much worse it could have been for them, I would have gladly taken their job and done it with a big fat smile on my face every day as long as they humped it in my boots for a day. But then again they would have been a liability to my team so I am glad I did not.

With that said I do appreciate all service men an women who continue to serve and make a career out of it, I however have left the army and my 6 year stint with the grunts to go air force and actually use my head a bit before it gets blown off.

[IPD]

i was being facetious. i didnt think you would actually take me seriously, but apparently its a sensitive subject for you. my apologies

perhaps i am a bit defensive in this area. perhaps too there are many individuals who have risen to similar positions unduly and unjustly. i, however, am not a senator's son. my dad was a reservist e-6 in avionics for two decades; before that, he was an army grunt in laos during nam (he actually had the opportunity to train as a helo pilot warrant officer--and ultimately decided it was too dangerous for his liking. based on loss rates during that time, i can't say many would blame him).

i come from a family of 4 kids and a total annual income well below the poverty line. with regards to my extended family on my mom's side, i'm one of about 6 (of a total of 38) grandkids who actually earned a 4-year degree. my mom never finished her degree (about 4 classes shy). my dad has an associates...but he was illiterate until age 35. i'm the first in my family with a degree (only one of my sisters has a degree). while my classmates were getting new/gently used cars as HS graduation presents for college--i was getting around on a bmx bike. my first computer and my first car COMBINED cost less than $1500; and i paid for nearly all of it.

i won't bore you with the rest of the petty details of my life. suffice it to say that i've had to push myself to where i am. telling me that i haven't earned the compensation i derive for the work i perform is completely inane--especially when you factor in my annual income is still <$70,000. i have prior-e friends who were making more as linguists than i am currently--and while i'm sure that's somewhat of an exception...it's not the only exception. furthermore, i'm well aware that i am at all times responsible for insuring the safety of assets that i work with. ROE is both a boon and a crutch--and a bad day on the job can serve me up on a court martial. it's bad enough to know that if you f**k, you're dead; it's worse when you know that if you f**k, others will die--and not necessarily due to enemy fire.

p.s.

i'll also remind you that the lowest paid player in the NFL makes more than the highest tenured o-10 in the military.

[tazman]

What a bunch of rhetoric!

The OP (Jeff) brought up a suggestion, and it's up to Alan to implement it or not. As Stealthee posted, it could be a part of the "Chatter" section. Either way, I don't see the harm if providing a venue for people to send care packages to the troops. It would be much more meaningful to get a personalized care package, than to get a package addressed "To any Sailor/Soldier, Marine, Air Force."

Oh, and if anyone is wondering, I'm a U.S. Navy Chief Warrant Officer, with over 25 years active duty, and still serving!