Questions about AWD ATX

[BigTyla]

BTW, is this stemming from the thread on 3si? Just about every single post in there is mis-information, just an FYI.

Shooter's thread, yes. I approach every thread with caution though, which led me to these questions.

[Emilie@GZP]

Shooter's thread, yes. I approach every thread with caution though, which led me to these questions.

OH, I was referring to the recent ATX AWD thread posted up a few days ago on there.

[Emilie@GZP]

Indeed it is. I have a spare one lying around in my garage from my Talon and VR4Rob was commenting on just how big it is.

But, if you were wanting to go with a lot of power...say, 600+AWHP, you would want an upgraded output shaft. Why not just go ahead and replace the stock output shaft with a 300M, use the Getrag transfer case, and not have to do anything to the driveshaft?

I'll take a look around for your build thread.

You can probably use the output shaft the DSM guys use, I'm sure they make a hardened one.

And I don't recall 3SX or Nelson ever reporting output shaft problems at their power levels.

[Chris@Rvengeperformance]

if someone wants to repost the steps and the info here that would be nice

[BigTyla]

You can probably use the output shaft the DSM guys use, I'm sure they make a hardened one.

And I don't recall 3SX or Nelson ever reporting output shaft problems at their power levels.

Oh sure, I'm just trying to get around welding a driveshaft. Don't like the sound of that at all. Then again, the DSM transfer case might be able to hold more power if we use the assumption that bigger = better.

To me, it seems just replacing the output shaft in the W4A33 with a 300M would be the easiest and most reliable solution. Then again, I don't have first-hand experience with the ATX conversion so I'm just trying to understand what the thought process was behind your car, IPDs, and others.

[Emilie@GZP]

Any welder or machine shop should have no problem welding it, and relatively cheap. I had no issues with mine at all being welded.

My build thread wasn't really a step-by-step. And it was integrated into an AWD conversion, along with the ATX.

Converting a VR4 to ATX is a COMPLETELY different ballgame.

[BigTyla]

Converting a VR4 to ATX is a COMPLETELY different ballgame.

Should be easier, should it not? Only difference is integrating the TCU, right?

[Emilie@GZP]

Yes. It's a bit of a wiring Pain in the ass if you try to retain the turbo harness, and "splice" in the TCU wiring, with a clean fit/finish. We're in the midst of doing it now, it's really the only major part holding up the project, and Hans is just DREADING diving back into this wiring...

[BigTyla]

Yes. It's a bit of a wiring Pain in the ass if you try to retain the turbo harness, and "splice" in the TCU wiring, with a clean fit/finish. We're in the midst of doing it now, it's really the only major part holding up the project, and Hans is just DREADING diving back into this wiring...

Haha yeah that is definitely not a fun thing to do, but hey, now that the harness is out you might as well do a wire tuck for him!

[IPD]

Let me preface this by saying I am aware of the various ATX AWD threads out there and am familiar with them (specifically, Inperfectdarkness AWD ATX Conversion! - 3000GT/Stealth International Message Center. That said, there are a couple of questions left unanswered in those threads that I would like addressed here. IPD, this has your name written all over it.

1) Since the front driveshaft section from an n/a AWD needs to be used, this effectively shortens the total length of the driveshaft. How are you still able to connect the driveshaft to the rear diff and the transfer case? It doesn't appear that the n/a transfer case is longer than the turbo one.

2) It seems the n/a AWD W4A33s are pretty hard to find. From what I hear, the W4A33 bellhousing from the DSM is different than the bolt pattern on the 6G72. Why not just make an adapter plate that mates the DSM W4A33 to the 6G72? Is the bellhousing really that different?

tyla, according to evan (shooter83) the 6-speed and n/a awd driveshafts are nearly identical. he even did comparison pics. we both felt it was at least "theoretically" possible to put the nipple from the n/a driveshaft on a 6-speed shaft, and have it work. it wasn't tried...but that was our hunch.

JDM Engine Depot

i sourced my trans from these guys. i see 6g7x w4q33 transmissions going for ~$300 all the time, so it's really a bargain as far as that goes. i've had zero problems with these guys, so if i bought another, i'd buy there again.


as noted, the price is stupidly low. ah, the beauty of awd atx.

you'll need a 6-speed rear end.

the dsm's use 2 different types of output shafts. iirc, 21 and 22 spline (don't quote me). i actually don't even know what type is on my car, lol!

my plan is to run my transmission STOCK and see how it holds up to the higher power levels. to my knowledge, stripping the output shaft is not a big problem for awd atx's...there just isn't the same kind of jolting force being applied as there is in an mtx in most cases.

i agree that vr4> atx is a pita...but it shouldn't be nearly as involved as the awd atx coinversion from fwd atx. there's really 3 key wires that have to be spliced into the tt harness/ecu from the TCU. evan had to wire my fans to be permanently on the "on" position as well. other than that, no real issues.