Giants win!

[AdamVR4]

It was Kyle Williams both times on those fumbles. And the OT fumble was forced. If there's any excuse/blame in that game it would be 9'ers coaching staff for not benching him. He was diving for punts, calling fair catches when no one was around, muffed a punt, lost a fumble in OT... Granted, Ginn was hurt, but Williams should've been parked on the sidelines. Anyone else would've been a massive improvement. They got out-coached and out-played, and as a result, lost the game.

Jeremy

I will agree that the 49ers should have benched him. And yes, now I recall the punt earlier in the game that he caught on a dive (he came THAT close to F'ing up 3 punts). But the ball grazing his knee (and the officials actually making the right call) was luck. Williams didn't protect the ball that you want to say the Giants forced out. How often did you see turnovers on punts this year? Maybe 1% of the time? And it happened twice? The Giants did not out play the 49ers. Eli did out play Alex Smith, but the 49ers out rushed the Giants and both defenses were dirty as hell. It really came down to 1 guy being an idiot.

[IPD]

Wait, that's your data point? LOL! I watched that game in its entirety (rooting for the 49ers) and the ONLY reason the Giants won was because of two dumb-luck plays: ~10 minutes to go in 4th, Giants punt, 49ers "muff" it (barely touch it). Results in Giant TD that gives Giants the lead; OT: 49ers fumble punt return setting up easy FG. You NEVER see that shit in the NFL and recovering fumbles, basically by definition, comes down to luck. No, the giants didn't deserve to beat the 49ers.

the giants deserved to beat the 49ers about twice as much as the pats deserved to beat the ravens.

[JasonY]

Pats lost because they have two tight ends and two slot recievers my size and about 30 other undrafted players on the team.

Brady is that fucking good hes in the SB(with some luck) with only two elite big players complimented by Welker, no Gronc really hurt the pats.

That said, i did pick the Giants but wanted the Pats to win.

The animosity towards Brady i dont get, it comes off as the now growing hatred towards greatness in this country. We used to want to be that guy, not so many people hate that guy.

Oh and if Welker catches that ball at the 20, Pats win and everyone is singing a different tune.

The Giants have so much more talent top to bottom(sans tight end and QB) on their team, it really shouldnt even have been a game. But the Hoody and Brady really are that good, deal with it.

Jason

[IPD]

the animosity is because of the attitude of pats fans, and the fact that bellichek is a red-handed cheater. the lack of respect for brady has to do with the conviction that any average QB would do just as well with an o-line like the pats have. if david carr had gone to NE instead of houston, he'd be the one wearing rings (plural) right now. (and yes, i know he's a giant currently).

[HilbillyHomeboy]

LOL... If not for all the drops, NE wins the Super Bowl and we're talking about witnessing arguably the greatest QB in the history of the NFL. Now he's not even in the top 4 of the league?

Who says he's not in the top 4? I most certainly did not say that. I have a right to the TYPE of QB I prefer. And I prefer a guy that can scramble, and take monster hits while making completions. Brady is a pure pocket passer, which is fine, that's how NE runs their offense(and it works very well). Eli is in the same league as the "elite" of the current NFL. The dude is good, damn good, and he proved that this year, quite convincingly.

I will agree that the 49ers should have benched him. And yes, now I recall the punt earlier in the game that he caught on a dive (he came THAT close to F'ing up 3 punts). But the ball grazing his knee (and the officials actually making the right call) was luck. Williams didn't protect the ball that you want to say the Giants forced out. How often did you see turnovers on punts this year? Maybe 1% of the time? And it happened twice? The Giants did not out play the 49ers. Eli did out play Alex Smith, but the 49ers out rushed the Giants and both defenses were dirty as hell. It really came down to 1 guy being an idiot.

So, now forced fumbles aren't forced, they are now called unprotected drops? LOL, please. You want to criticize IPD for his data point, but you're going to try and justify a fumble with lame excuses like this? C'mon, you're better than this.

Coaching is a huge aspect of the game. Since the 9'ers kept putting Williams at the same duty, they deserve the outcome. Kyle Williams isn't exactly a bad player. A bit of a greenhorn, but he made a few big plays this season. So, there was apparently something that was in his head...

Since the Giants didn't deserve to be in the playoffs, then I can rightfully assert your opinion of GB last year is the same?

I agree Jason, blind hatred is silly. Brady is a phenomenon, no doubt. But it's not his moment this year. Eli shredded the post season, down a very difficult road, and absolutely deserves his praise.

Jeremy

[AdamVR4]

So, now forced fumbles aren't forced, they are now called unprotected drops? LOL, please. You want to criticize IPD for his data point, but you're going to try and justify a fumble with lame excuses like this? C'mon, you're better than this.

Surely you've seen enough football to know the difference between a truly forced fumble and a situation where the ball was being held carelessly.

Coaching is a huge aspect of the game. Since the 9'ers kept putting Williams at the same duty, they deserve the outcome. Kyle Williams isn't exactly a bad player. A bit of a greenhorn, but he made a few big plays this season. So, there was apparently something that was in his head...

Exactly. You're almost never going to see coaches yank a guy after a mental mistake because they don't want to crush his confidence. That's like saying you should yank your QB after a couple bad interceptions... And if he throws another one, the coaches deserve the blame. Tough situation.

Since the Giants didn't deserve to be in the playoffs, then I can rightfully assert your opinion of GB last year is the same?

By my count, the 2010 Packers (10-6) beat 3 playoff teams during the regular season.

If it's such a disadvantage to be a lower seeded team in the playoffs, why do they keep winning superbowls? Why do top teams keep losing after the bye week?

[BigTyla]

If it's such a disadvantage to be a lower seeded team in the playoffs, why do they keep winning superbowls?

Coaching and late-season adjustments.

Why do top teams keep losing after the bye week?

Lack of proper coaching and late-season adjustments.

[HilbillyHomeboy]

Surely you've seen enough football to know the difference between a truly forced fumble and a situation where the ball was being held carelessly.

There are no level of forced fumbles. You either drop it of your own volition, or someone forces it out. You can be mad at your player for not securing the ball they way you think he should've, but it doesn't change the stats(recorded forced fumble for the Giants).

Exactly. You're almost never going to see coaches yank a guy after a mental mistake because they don't want to crush his confidence. That's like saying you should yank your QB after a couple bad interceptions... And if he throws another one, the coaches deserve the blame. Tough situation.

It's not the same. Most teams don't have a QB behind them that is equal to the starter(save for GB). There's typically a half dozen guys on any given team that can catch a punt. After all of the mistakes Williams made, in regular time, he had 0 business being in the game. Poor coaching, IMO. They lost, it's not going to change, and there were no bad calls to make excuses over.

By my count, the 2010 Packers (10-6) beat 3 playoff teams during the regular season.

If it's such a disadvantage to be a lower seeded team in the playoffs, why do they keep winning superbowls? Why do top teams keep losing after the bye week?

You said the playoff field is too wide. GB was the wild card #6 seed. Thus, by your definition, they didn't belong.

Of course it's a disadvantage. Are you arguing that starting 6th is better than starting 1st? The Pats didn't lose after the bye week this year. The Steelers didn't lose last year after the bye week. And on and on, it's no guarantee that any team is going to win based on their seed. All it proves is that the system works. Precluding teams that faltered, but are obvious contenders, is a travesty.

The 9'ers need to throw the ball better.
The Pats need to draft better; it's catching up with them.
The Pack needs to get their D back on track.
The Giants need to just keep on keeping on.

Jeremy

[AdamVR4]

There are no level of forced fumbles.

There's also no statistical difference between a terrible interception and one the wide receiver sets like a volleyball, but everyone watching can tell the difference. A grandma could have "forced" that fumble

It's not the same. Most teams don't have a QB behind them that is equal to the starter(save for GB). There's typically a half dozen guys on any given team that can catch a punt. After all of the mistakes Williams made, in regular time, he had 0 business being in the game. Poor coaching, IMO.

Fair point.

You said the playoff field is too wide. GB was the wild card #6 seed. Thus, by your definition, they didn't belong.

"Belonging" and "deserving" are pretty different words. Clearly, these wildcard teams that get hot "belong". Whether or not their play during the regular season warrants a 9-7 team taking the field against a 15-1 team is another.

Of course it's a disadvantage. Are you arguing that starting 6th is better than starting 1st?

2005, 2007, 2010... Recent wildcard superbowl champs.

2009: a pair of one seeds (Saints vs Colts)

2008: Steelers, had a first round bye

2006: 3 seed Colts.

So since 2005, 2 teams with 1st round byes have won the superbowl while 5 teams that didn't have first round byes won the superbowl. Yes, I think you could make an argument that the bye hurts teams. It's sort of like the time off before college bowl games hurting teams' offensive rhythm, etc.

[HilbillyHomeboy]

I'm changing your screen name to Mikes2ndJr.

Jeremy