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Thread: Piston and ring info...

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    Piston and ring info...

    theres been a bunch of threads about pistons, brands, shelf stock pistons etc. in those threads i stated my deal about custom pistons and rings that i have built by Ross and why the customs i came up with and sold for the past 10 years are superior.

    a picture is worth 1000 words. this is a competitors Ross piston... theres no need for me to name them because it can be anyone. we have our own design that only we use.

    in this piston, the top ring is a cast coated moly ring which is junk in the turbo car world. high temps and high cylinder pressure make the ring lose its spring and sit flush in the piston with no outward thrust...notice the ring gap there.. the heat also makes the coating peal off as seen in the pics. the blow by then causes scuffing in the skirts.

    also, these use oil ring spacers which my 3.0-3.1 pistons do not. our pistons are built around parts and designs that work!

    i cant price war with everyone because cheap parts are not my thing when it comes to engines. i can only use my knowledge and build the best parts out there for the best price i can.


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    I'm not a fan of those spacers, and consider that enough reason to buy yours... But I'm curious, are the competitors pistons in your pics marketed with with rings included, or did someone make the decision to use those rings on their own?


    Real Performance Automotive (541)816-4500 www.FB.com/RealPerformanceAuto

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    Stroker pistons always need spacers but the 3.0s do not. That is the rings that they come with because that's the ones they are cut for. That is the reason I had to come up with a piston that was built around a good ring set

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Pampena View Post
    Stroker pistons always need spacers but the 3.0s do not. That is the rings that they come with because that's the ones they are cut for. That is the reason I had to come up with a piston that was built around a good ring set
    Yea, I've had to use the spacers in strokers in other platforms... You do what you have to do, but if the option is there to NOT use them that's my preference.

    I just don't get the thinking behind using those rings in the first place..? Cost cutting? I honestly can't remember the last time I pulled a cast ring out of a top groove in anything...

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    Yep, I have seen that piston and the skirt scuff after very little miles many times before. Was never a big fan of that piston/ring setup. Much happier with my Wiseco setup I have now and probably be even more happier with a set of Ray's pistons/rings.

    -Chris

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    Now with more poop-smear Not Verified Feedback Score 8 (100%) IPD's Avatar
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    but at least the ringlands aren't broken?

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    One fix at a time verified Feedback Score 4 (100%) TurboSinceBirth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Pampena View Post
    Stroker pistons always need spacers but the 3.0s do not. That is the rings that they come with because that's the ones they are cut for. That is the reason I had to come up with a piston that was built around a good ring set
    Yep. Ray's stroker Ross pistons have a spacer on the top and bottom of the oil ring. I kind of wish I was more careful when I had the pistons in and out while I was grinding the girdle and block because the side skirts weren't in perfect shape, but I was probably being too paranoid. I'm confident the rings will seal in real well. I had a set of 93mm Ross pistons in the engine before when it was a 3.1L. I don't know if GT Pro ordered directly from Ross, but for how few of miles were on the pistons(~10k) I wasn't very impressed with the rings or the wear. Most of that I attribute to the builders of the engine, but at least now I have a good set of rings and pistons.
    95 RT/TT Billet TD04s E70, DW1000cc injectors, ARC-2 with 92mm maf, 3SX fuel rail loop, hotwired Walbro 416/485, 3" FMIC, single small Krank vent, DR 3.5" downpipe and cat-back, DNP 02 housings, Hallman Pro MBC, BlackStealth LCDBC, AEM wideband, AEM oil pressure, Apexi S1 coilovers with SCE EVO 8/9 adapters, 3SX adjustable control arms, Spec 3+ clutch, Maximal solids/3SX poly motor mounts, Setrab custom SMOC, stock motor 127k miles, stock drivetrain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by steve68 View Post
    Skirts get scuffing when the piston gets too hot and too big, because it's put together with insufficient piston to bore clearance.

    Steve
    Yes and the piston skirts get to hot and grow when the rings don't seal and you have too much blow by which is obviously the case in these pictures...which is the purpose of this thread

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    Quote Originally Posted by inperfectdarkness View Post
    but at least the ringlands aren't broken?
    Every forum needs it's inside joke... I can't say if it's good or bad that we came up with such an epic one so quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by steve68 View Post
    Skirts get scuffing when the piston gets too hot and too big, because it's put together with insufficient piston to bore clearance.

    Steve
    There ya go... The expert schools us again.

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    Verrrrryyyy interesting. I have known that cast rings were the problems of many engines but thought it was from bad wear and not that their spring was lost. Usually the only time I see a ring gap like that the piston has already seized.

    Oil ring design- I didnt follow what was written. In the photo I see the usual 3 piece ring construction but I'm not sure what you guys are talking about for an alternate construction. I have seen a few solid oil rings but I dont think you were talking about those. Any better descriptions or maybe a photo?

    Back in the 80's we used to have our slogan for two stroke piston users of "Seize with Wiseco." (Not win with wiseco) Why? Because they would seize. Pistons were fitted according to spec BUT the shape of the skirt was not well done and portions of the skirt would stick. The solution was prep as usual, do a light run-in, and then remove the pistons and sand down all the high spots. THEN they would last.

    I doubt that happens any more in this computer controlled age but as we all know quality issues arise on all kinds of parts in EVERYTHING these days. Its tough to make a good decision on what will last.

    Thanks for a good techie thread.

    -SP

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