Who do you think killed JFK

[GTO Assassin]

Sorry, can I take back my "new bullet" post and say that the bullet looked a little worse for wear, but not like it had gone thru two humans.

[j2k4]

I have always been fascinated with the whole assassination of JFK, plus his brother Robert's assassination, Hoffa and the truckers union, Lee Harvey and Cuba. I love Oliver Stone's movie but as it's not a documentary, you can hardly say everything in there is true..... However, alot of it (according to various key people ie Jim Garrison) have verified many points in Stone's movie.
A lot of you weren't born when it happened (me included) but maybe your parents spoke of it. Would be interested to hear what you guys think.

I recently saw this:


and that changed my mind on where the shot came from.

Scooter

"What difference at this point does it make?"

-Hillary Clinton

Ever notice how some people always and only ask easy-to-answer questions they don't want answered?



Anyway, I'll go ahead and ask the question, and wait for Scott's answer.

Or anyone else's, for that matter.

I'm not sure what you are asking. You posted some uninterested post at the top which told me you didn't give a shit, yet here you are. You either have an opinion, or you don't. Post up your opinion or don't. If you're asking me "at this point, what difference does it make" then the answer lies in my very first post. Maybe try reading it first insstead of being a smart arse just trying to be funny.

Scooter

I mean to ask the same question Hillary asked, but seriously.

If I look at the post you refer to, you seem to be indicating the dilemma should be resolved in order to satisfy your curiosity as well as that of others who are not quite sick of a subject which brings to mind an old Mark Twain quote:

"Many commentators have shed much darkness upon the subject, and if they continue, we shall soon know nothing at all about it".

I have heard every speculation, and watched every televised effort to get at the "truth" - you apparently have not, in which case I urge you to continue your search.

My own opinion (remember now, you asked for this) has degenerated from a curiosity not unlike your own, to an apathy I cannot describe, and which leads me to ask the question I've asked.

Tell me, Scott - if we found out tomorrow that Sam Giancana stumbled on whatever plot that gave birth to Oswald's effort, and decided to augment it with one of his own, just because JFK was banging Judith Exner, what do you think would happen then?

What would change?

Have you never in your life said, 'Oh, fuck it, just fuck it"?

I have, but then, I'm older than you, and I have absorbed the fact that the money to be bled from the ongoing mystery trumps any interest I may have in closure, at least on the subject at hand.

Your "fascination" will expire at some point, I promise.

[IPD]

Sorry, can I take back my "new bullet" post and say that the bullet looked a little worse for wear, but not like it had gone thru two humans.

as I said, it went through soft tissue in JFK (his neck) and was tumbling before it hit bone. that's why the nose of the bullet showed no damage.

[Valhallaz]

I simply don't believe that a guy that was an average shooter, at best, could have hit twice in 3 attempts from Oswald's location. Far better marksmen tried to duplicate the shot and failed... I don't buy getting that lucky twice.

[Vantage]

Who do you think killed JFK

I don't know, but I'd bet they also killed the deputy.

[j2k4]

I don't know, but I'd bet they also killed the deputy.

Being a "smart-arse", aren't you?

[IPD]

I simply don't believe that a guy that was an average shooter, at best, could have hit twice in 3 attempts from Oswald's location. Far better marksmen tried to duplicate the shot and failed... I don't buy getting that lucky twice.

I direct my questioning on who is the authority that declared LHO a mediocre shooter? Why is this accepted at face value, when I see almost no evidence pointing one way or another. If I'm expected to believe that IN THE MIDDLE OF FRICKING TEXAS that there's no where out in the middle of nowhere, where LHO could practice his firearms skills unobserved...well then I'll buy that waterfront property you have in Nevada.

We know for certain that bullet #2 (the magic bullet) was proven to have been fired from LHO's gun (forensic ballistics). And unless I'm mistaken, I believe they proved that LHO had fired the gun (powder residue, etc).

So about the only way you could frame this as a conspiracy would be to claim that someone else did the 3x shooting and they got LHO to be a patsy in a complex cover-up operation, or that there was another shooter from almost the identical vantage point (because the trajectories don't match anywhere else), who escaped notice. That's a lot of "if's" though.

[Alan92RTTT]

Was Lee Harvey Oswald an Expert Marksman? : The JFK Assassination

Simulating the JFK Assassination

For the benefit of the Warren Commission, expert riflemen from the US Army and the FBI attempted to duplicate the assassin’s task, using the rifle that had been discovered on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository.

Even after fixing some of the gun’s mechanical problems, and despite firing at stationary targets from an easier vantage point, they failed to achieve the combination of accuracy and speed demanded of the lone gunman: two hits out of three, within about six seconds (see Warren Commission Hearings, vol.3, p.446 and pp.403–10).

How Good a Shot was Oswald?

Oswald had served in the Marines several years before the JFK assassination, and had been trained and tested in rifle shooting. The Warren Commission needed to show that he was a better marksman than the experts from the US Army and the FBI.
Oswald’s Marine Rifle Marksmanship Scores

In the late 1950s, US Marines were categorised at three levels of shooting ability, according to the scores they achieved at a standardised test of their accuracy:

Expert: a score of 220 to 250.
Sharpshooter: 210 to 219.
Marksman: 190 to 209.

According to his Marine score card (Commission Exhibit 239), Oswald was tested twice:

In December 1956, after “a very intensive 3 weeks’ training period” (Warren Commission Hearings, vol.11, p.302), Oswald scored 212: two marks above the minimum for a ‘sharpshooter’.
In May 1959, he scored 191: one mark above the minimum for a ‘marksman’.

Colonel Allison Folsom interpreted the results for the Warren Commission:

The Marine Corps consider that any reasonable application of the instructions given to Marines should permit them to become qualified at least as a marksman. To become qualified as a sharpshooter, the Marine Corps is of the opinion that most Marines with a reasonable amount of adaptability to weapons firing can become so qualified. Consequently, a low marksman qualification indicates a rather poor “shot” and a sharpshooter qualification indicates a fairly good “shot”.

(Warren Commission Hearings, vol.19, pp.17f)

Folsom agreed with his (not her) questioner that Oswald “was not a particularly outstanding shot” (Warren Commission Hearings, vol.8, p.311).

The Quality of Oswald’s Rifles

During his tests, Oswald had used “presumably a good to excellent rifle” (Warren Commission Hearings, vol.11, p.304).

The Mannlicher Carcano rifle that was discovered on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository, however, was a “cheap old weapon” (Warren Commission Hearings, vol.4, p.29).

It was examined by the FBI’s firearms specialist, who stated that:

Every time we changed the adjusting screws to move the crosshairs in the telescopic sight in one direction it also affected the movement of the impact or the point of impact in the other direction. … We fired several shots and found that the shots were not all landing in the same place, but were gradually moving away from the point of impact.

(Warren Commission Hearings, vol.3, p.405)

Ronald Simmons of the US Army also examined the rifle, and found problems with the bolt and the trigger mechanism:

There were several comments made — particularly with respect to the amount of effort required to open the bolt. … There was also comment made about the trigger pull … in the first stage the trigger is relatively free, and it suddenly required a greater pull to actually fire the weapon. … The pressure to open the bolt was so great that that we tended to move the rifle off the target.

(ibid., pp.449–51)

[IPD]

Let's also not forget that the people who claimed to hear as many as 6 shots were probably hearing echo's. Those who claimed to see "puffs of smoke" on the knoll were probably seeing debris from the 1st shot that missed.

Another problem with trying to grab eye-witness testimoy 40 years hence is that memories are volatile. Recent psychology experiments have proven that "false" memories can be imparted as well. I'm not saying that's absolutely the case here, but it is a known and accepted fact that immediate aftermath is the BEST time to gather witness statements.

Gunpowder smell isn't just in the vicinity of the gun fired. Ever smelled a target after it's been used? And how is it possible that an agent in the LEFT REAR of the follow car would have been able to make a shot on the president without DEAFENING everyone in the car he was riding in?

[j2k4]

Scott, buy this book and read it-

The Third Bullet: A Bob Lee Swagger Novel: Stephen Hunter: 9781451640229: Amazon.com: Books

It won't clarify anything, but it'll give you more theories to entertain while you thrash about.