Build philosophy. Share your best and worst.

I thought this would make a cool thread. The idea is to share the 3S-related things that have served you well, and those that have ended up being a hassle, pain in the neck, or are just generally not recommended. They can be very specific (a particular mod) or very general (an idea or philosophy). You can post more as you think of them. I'll start...

Best:

• Keeping my cars strictly "street" - on my TD05 car I kept all the important stuff. Full interior, A/C, nice stereo, etc. It took extra work, but I've thanked myself for it ever since. Life changes and sometimes all you want is a comfy car to take the girlfriend out for a cruise.
• Unsprung clutch - when I bought it, I worried it wouldn't be streetable. Totally worth it. While it can be a bit more jumpy on the street, I'm not fragging springs every time I dump it.

Worst:

• All solid mounts. Just don't do it, at least not on a street car. I'd maybe replace the front and rear, but keep the stock sides. See the first item above.
• Non-OEM body mods. While I love mixing and matching OEM parts, any aftermarket body items (everything from hoods to sunroofs to bumpers) has never fit quite right and always looked sub-par. I stay away now.

By the way, about this thread. It doesn't have to agree, and discussion is fine (you can post something the exact opposite of someone before) but try to avoid making it a debate thread. Make your point well and let others draw their own conclusions.

lots of vibration with solid mounts?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by keo92stealth

lots of vibration with solid mounts?

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I wouldn't say "lots", but it's noticeable.

Best...ARC2 for tuning, easy-peasy ;)

Worst...265 DZ101 tires on a 9.5 wide rim, too stretched :p

I wish I had the foresight as a teenager to impose that "street" requirement.

Things I removed: AC, Heat, windshield wipers, splash guards, all cats, CD player, speakers, antenna

Things I wish I had today: AC, Heat, windshield wipers, a cat, CD player, speakers

I'm in the process of slowly returning the car to something I can regularly drive on the street.

Things I think I'll have again some day: windshield wipers, a cat, CD player, speakers

Worst mod I ever did... Welded center differential

Best mod... Titan/DR headers (24 psi on pump gas on a piggyback with 740cc injectors, barely adjusting the stock timing map)

I'll echo the "full street equipment" sentiment.

Weight-loss should be kept in mind wherever it can be practiced without sacrificing comfort, which I just stupidly ignored by leaving my rear 6x9s in place (safe storage, I guess) even though they aren't part of the new sound system.

I try to keep in mind that all of the factory stuff - especially the stuff favored for a "delete" routine - was designed by people who are smarter than I am, and removal of same should be considered/undertaken with caution.

I do not want to sacrifice streetability by installing performance mods that don't fit with that philosophy; I guess that's why/how I found myself going with a turbo-car to begin with: one can own a nice, tame MINI-MONSTER. :biggrin:

My aim, with this car, is to max-out it's potential given it's limitations (cast crank, stock clutch); that should gave me a reliable GT car, which is what the car was designed to be anyway, right? :)

In general, my philosophy is to build and own a well rounded car that highlights what Mitsubishi did well and improve in areas that were lacking.

Mitsubishi designed and built an unbelievably good car over 20 years ago and a lot of the design doesn't need to or never will need to be changed, at least for my purpose. Yes, the car and it's design have limitations. Some of these can be improved with the technology that has developed since the car's inception and others should be accepted as a characteristic of it's design period.

What I strive to build is timeless. The design of the car is good enough to stand on it's own so it deserves modifications that do justice to that notion. It doesn't need to keep up with cars that are 20 years newer in any particular trend, be that styling, power, or technology. It doesn't have to try to be something it's not. It's a VR-4. And it's awesome.

LOL @ Adam's post. :)

I'd agree with Intropy for the most part as well, even down to the motor mounts (I only have solid front and rear, sides are stock.) If you've been on 3S boards long enough, no doubt you've seen me say my philosophy before... Less weight, keep creature comforts, and with a 1/4 mile goal of 11.7 on pump gas.

That was it. And I've never deviated from it, so I haven't wasted thousands of dollars like some other people do when they are constantly changing their minds about what direction they want to go with the car. Every time, it makes them buy a different set of turbos, or injectors, a whole new fuel controller system, new intercooler piping, etc. (Although I admit, I have been guilty of this in the past few years, I bought fixed headlights that I knew I would have to buy a different bumper to make work right, but then lost interest, bought a billet TC with 300M OS, fully intending to put them in, never did... ugh.)

But, in comparison to the long list of mods I have bought and used, I've kept on track and frugal for the most part.

Some more - this time focusing on deletes:

Best:

• ABS delete - some might disagree but I love this one. Super-clean, and I never liked the ABS on these cars anyway.
• AWS delete - didn't notice anything other than a lighter car.
• Remote IAC w/ FIAV delete - makes working on the upper engine a joy.

Worst:

• Cruise delete - cruise is nice sometimes... but I love the cleaner bay. Easier to work on.
• Cat converter delete - I'm with Adam, not that great.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VR4Rob

In general, my philosophy is to build and own a well rounded car that highlights what Mitsubishi did well and improve in areas that were lacking.

Mitsubishi designed and built an unbelievably good car over 20 years ago and a lot of the design doesn't need to or never will need to be changed, at least for my purpose. Yes, the car and it's design have limitations. Some of these can be improved with the technology that has developed since the car's inception and others should be accepted as a characteristic of it's design period.

What I strive to build is timeless. The design of the car is good enough to stand on it's own so it deserves modifications that do justice to that notion. It doesn't need to keep up with cars that are 20 years newer in any particular trend, be that styling, power, or technology. It doesn't have to try to be something it's not. It's a VR-4. And it's awesome.

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I couldn't agree more with this. I've never been a fan of deletes. I don't care if it's harder to work on the car - I don't plan to continuously change things anyway. Some of my most satisfying moments with the car have been in restoring things back to new condition.

Best

• Fully functional EGR, ABS, AWS.
• Autodimming mirror with temp and compass
• DVD navigation receiver with HD radio, iPod integration, and backup camera

Worst
Not having a built car.

Things I need to get in the future.

1. Turbo upgrade and supporting mods. I've been BPU forever.
2. Flashable ECU. Tuning without aftermarket or piggybacks
3. Black Stealth Boost Controller.

Best mods:
-Planning for me is key. Unless you are reinventing the wheel on a particular setup, mostly everything has been done and documented. My white car is, and always will be, a street car. Creature comforts are to me: A/C, interior, radio, heat, cruise control.
Things I like that I want to keep: adjustable suspension, abs, SRS

-Things that I've pulled that I don't need: Emissions equipment, but my car is a spring/summer/fall driver on ethanol gas, so the emissions should be very low. Having full control over the tune with the AEM afford me the luxury to remove clutter from the engine bay, while maintaining form/function/reliability.
-Solid motor mounts This car is 20 years old, a little vibration doesn't kill me :)

Worst mods:
-TD05 based 50 trims over the transmission. Talk about relocated heat pumps that cause problems
-Not putting full out slicks on my blue car when it was in "kill" mode, still kicking myself for that 11.45@135.76 "best" 1/4.
-Roll cage down bars (halo) in front of the dash. Looks cool, but should have went through the tweeter holes and put components in the doors
-Upgraded sidemount air heaters.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niterydr

Worst mods:
-Upgraded sidemount air heaters.

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Ha I LOLed a bit. Been there. Seems like you either stay stock or go FMIC, the other alternatives suck.

Ah, nostalgia. Some things I remember from my ATX TT are below.

Best:
1) Translab shift kit and modified valve body. Talk about a completely different car. Stock auto trans in these cars is pathetic.
2) TT conversion. I spent most of my summer doing it, but I'm glad I took my time with it and did it right. Car was a joy to drive after that. The auto trans really complements the turbos well IMO.

Worst:
1) Ksport coilovers. What a terrible idea that was. Word to the wise - don't cheap out on coilovers. Definitely made the stance look better but ride quality was awful.
2) Indiglo gauges. That was during my pre-enlightenment age where I didn't realize the stock gauges were great to begin with.

Best: Research, research, research.

Worst: Cutting corners due to being impatient and not saving up for the correct part for the job.

Every issue I've had with my FWD TT was from cutting a corner, either with not doing enough research or from buying an inferior part. Now that everything is fixed years later I'm selling the car. Would have been awesome to have done it right first and enjoyed the car at 100% for a few years.

I could go on for a year, but here are some highlights.

Best: switching to flashed ecu, replacing pretty much everything that was worn out. Staying on stock style springs. Ride is great, height is good, performance is good, and everything fits like it should. Sticking with stock frame turbos and replacing items most people throw away like the heatshields.

worst: trying to tune SD on the EMU. I'm sure there are a decent handful of people that have gotten this to work, but it was too much work for me. I had it running perfect for about a couple days. Then there were plenty of times when the car was almost undriveable and really made me hate it/feel unsafe. I guess the lesson is tune within your personal limits or ambition. It just isn't worth it to me to chase down that last 20 HP and spend forever tweaking it. Besides some mechanical problems i was having I have a perfectly runnable tune in a couple minutes on the flashed ecu.

I never had any problems tuning just be airflow though, so the EMU and EMB are good units in my book. My problems started when I went SD.

I know! I'll do a TT AWD conversion instead of buying a VR4. :awesome:

so far i like everything ive ever done to my car and dont have any regrets. as soon as i got my vr4 i started trying to make everything under the hood easier to work on/get to. So i did end up removing pretty much anything that didnt make the car faster under the hood. there were some draw backs (no A/C being #1) but so far its been about 3-4 years now and i really dont miss anything i deleted. every time i see a stock under-hood pic i feel better about deleting as much stuff as i could from the engine bay, or at least relocating the part to a different part of the car.

Best:
Battery in trunk.
Latitude 42 headlights
Black 'Ebay' leather seat covers. they came out great on both of my cars
Deft 2g style CF hood. (i always HATED the stock hood blisters)
IPS 'drag strip' brake kit. talk about being able to bounce the passengers head off the dash like a basketball.
T-case brace (who in there right mind wouldn't buy one of these?!?!)
Blow through GM MAF
painted the 'mustache' the same color as the body

Worst:
IPS 'drag strip' brake kit. these brakes will make some serious noise when your going less than ~5mph and very lightly apply the brakes. aka going through a parking lot or slowly decelerating at a stop sign.

Best:

• Going with a "stockish" built engine - no 3.5, no stroker, nothing fancy. I had one engine let go on me (before I knew much about oiling problems in the 6g72) and I'm not sure I would have had the heart to do it again if I had trashed something custom.

Worst:

• Slotted, drilled, or anything else rotors.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by green-lantern

I know! I'll do a TT AWD conversion instead of buying a VR4. :awesome:

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I raise you "I know!, I'll buy a hardtop and transplant a sunroof!" lol

i'm absolutely tickled pink that i'm seeing you guys post up about catalytic converters. i've endured years of hearing about how they should be done away with entirely. i have to say that it's one of biggest things i don't like about my car after i did the new exhaust. the D.R.O.N.E. is bone-jarring.

i second everything tyla said about atx's. my car feels like it was MEANT to have tt's--and that's just with 9b's @ 8psi.

biggest regret i've got about my car so far is messing with the lighter outlet. it hasn't worked since. i had pipe-dreams about relocating it to that useless coin-tray in front of the radio, but i never did get around to doing it.

i'm also kind of agreeing about non-OEM body panels--but maybe that's because i've NEVER had my hood painted a proper body-color the entire time i've owned it. i really wish i had stock roof or sunroof though--my aftermarket one is ok, but isn't great (i didn't install that sunroof).

*eleventy on "i should have bought a vr4". If i'd had the resources (and an available shop) to handle atx converting a vr4, i would have done it. that said, i have ZERO regrets about keeping atx. to me, it feels more natural--since i don't see my 3/s as a "pure no-compromises" car. for me the 3/s is a grand TOURER, and a refined, relaxed eloquent one. not a japanese ferrari; a japanese MASERATI. the smooth seeming effortlessness of the atx fits that rather well for me. the incredible inexpensive of them (comparatively speaking) is also a plus.

ask me in another year or so if i have any regrets about the 20k i threw at it last year....

Interesting posts.

All I have done is BPU mods on the VR-4 and left the RT/TT pretty much strock. Like the other post, I prefer to only replace those parts that makes stock weak, like wheels, exhaust, turbos. I think Ray's latest build with his red car is the right mindset.

Minus, the turbos I've got what I need to build a 450'ish awh car. I just need the motivation to do it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Intropy

Best:

• Going with a "stockish" built engine - no 3.5, no stroker, nothing fancy. I had one engine let go on me (before I knew much about oiling problems in the 6g72) and I'm not sure I would have had the heart to do it again if I had trashed something custom.

Worst:

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You did handle that awfully well. I was like, "it doesn't seem to faze him, is he going to shoot himself in the head later"?

The moment you want to throw a wrench, is the moment you go inside and play some Skyrim.

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Originally Posted by The Linchpin

The moment you want to throw a wrench, is the moment you go inside and play some Skyrim.

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Is that what you damn kids call masturbation these days?

i love me some RPG, but I do not have 250+ hours to throw at that game.


http://i.qkme.me/35t5qa.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Linchpin

The moment you want to throw a wrench, is the moment you go inside and play some Skyrim.

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SWTOR has been my Achilles - luckily I'm getting fed up with it and can now focus on the rides,

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jimvr4

[*]Autodimming mirror with temp and compass

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What'd you go with?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Intropy

Worst:

• Slotted, drilled, or anything else rotors.

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Care to elaborate? I recently chose regular new rotors over slotted or drilled, mainly due to price, but wondered if I made the wrong choice.


-Matt

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Linchpin

The moment you want to throw a wrench, is the moment you go inside and play some Skyrim.

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I used to want to play Skyrim, but then I took an arrow to the knee.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tos

Care to elaborate? I recently chose regular new rotors over slotted or drilled, mainly due to price, but wondered if I made the wrong choice.


-Matt

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He is wrong about that one, slotted will stop a car better but it will wear your pads a lot quicker. It's like a cheese grater, it gives resistance but shreds the material.

Lol, i used to play skyrim...... Shame on you, somebodys been on 9gag/tumblr


My overall philosophy with a car i want to enjoy is why replace when you can upgrade! ( performance enthusiast mindset i suppose)

Otherwise simple mods to get the job done, ive thuroughly enjoyed rays budget 10 sec car builds, they may not have turbos the size of bass drums, but when you can wrangle over 500 wheel and sub 10 sec track times with a relatively stockish car, who needs em?

But back on.topic

Worst : from my dsm days- lightened flywheel- hate it hate it hate it
removal of sound deadening- friend decided to do me a "favor" and scrapped it clean when i ran into town for a couple hours for a parts run, the thing sounded like a tin can on wheels since.

Best: abs delete, coopkills/pansy patrols engine bay cleanup mods
ATR Exhaust and DN precats- makes the cars throaty note really come out, i even impressed a few older street rod guys i know who work over chevy 350's and ride harleys in their daily grind.

One potential mod i may regret/love-finishing this conversion to big single turbo (unknown territory, difficult to pull off correctly, lots of other already potent options available, mostly just to experiment like trevor/icelandic and taz and an

Also an unsprung 6 puck clutch, chris hill said the spec 4+ isnt too rough, and ive heard horror stories otherwise from pedal feel, guess ill weld and balance the hub for the known rivet issue and see how it does!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by arm0red1

Lol, i used to play skyrim...... Shame on you, somebodys been on 9gag/tumblr

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http://suzumiyayuki.files.wordpress....-rage-face.jpg

Okay... :(

http://i50.tinypic.com/24bsnsx.jpg

I can't say for sure if my 3.5" high flow cat made a placebo effect with quieting my exhaust/reducing drone but it might just be bearable enough to keep as is.

Best:
CFDS
Lightweight wheels
BBK
BlackStealth LCD boost controller
Apexi coilovers
more to come...

Worst:
Local machine shop replacing copper o-rings in block--big time fail and I didn't have the heart to complete it.
Hacking up a FMIC kit to fit T3 turbos without being able to reweld everything.
No garage mod. :(
SS braided fuel lines. I hate how abrasive they were.