I haven't played any multi yet. I used to be a GOD with SC1 multiplayer, but SC2... I know I would suck. Then again, I also don't have the time to devote to playing and practicing much.
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I haven't played any multi yet. I used to be a GOD with SC1 multiplayer, but SC2... I know I would suck. Then again, I also don't have the time to devote to playing and practicing much.
lies. you're not south korean, and we all know it.Quote:
Originally Posted by UTRacerX9
LOL just means I see the screen even better.
You're being humble. Depending on how your playstyle was during SC1, you might be better at SC2. Macro is so much easier now.Quote:
Originally Posted by UTRacerX9
I still need a lot of work on macro and micro. Really I just need to figure out a good build to begin with. I'm trying to master Protoss so I might just go with a standard 4-gate build. I did watch a game by HuK where he used 7 gates and made Stalkers with a VERY early blink upgrade. That appeals to me since I like Stalkers. :)
LOL I'm not kidding, playing the campaign, I have a hard time beating the last mission against Kerrigan without getting overrun, and when playing the Protoss, that one mission where you need to last as long as you can and kill 1500 enemies, that took a few tries as well. My main problem is defense. I'm just not playing as efficiently as I should be.
4-gating is the best ticket to being a diamond player. sc2builds.com is a very underused site, but has some good builds on it. if you don't watch any replay casts, i'd highly suggest watching hdstarcraft, huskystarcraft, artosis, forcesc2strategy and day9. day9 is likely the most analytical, tied for most entertaining with husky (different take on entertainment delivery...both quite good IMO). they're all worth watching. day9 does a live show most nights at 10pm est, 7pm pst on justin.tv. archives of his shows are available on youtube and blip.tvQuote:
Originally Posted by BigTyla
best defense is a good offense...seriously. the last mission is a total bitch, i'm trying to beat it on hard using the artifact only once for the achieveable, so hard. i quit a while age. the protoss mission...trying to make it to 2250 for the achieveable on that, too. got up to like 2050. DT's on hold position at the chokes are your friends at the beginning, as are phoenixes. lift up the hybrids, have the other units take them out. also, if you haven't seen it yet, there is a high yield expansion in the top left corner. just make sure you can defend at the end of the bridge before taking it, you will need to split the side defenses slightly at that point to take it.Quote:
Originally Posted by UTRacerX9
I have been watching day[9] religiously over the past two weeks, especially the Newbie Tuesday casts. Really cool guy.Quote:
Originally Posted by sketch
I've browsed Team Liquid here and there but it seems very disorganized. I'll check out sc2builds.com.
i would highly recommend day9 daily 100 and day9 daily 200. 100 is the "my life of starcraft" and not at all a game focused daily, 200 is one of the first "team monobattle" funday mondays. althought quite goofy, the funday mondays can be highly educational as they can force you to do quite interesting builds. there was one that focused on mass queen production - you had to ALWAYS be producing a queen. from every hatchery. at all time (obv not before spawning pool) and it produced quite interesting games. there was another for "no matter what's happening, you need to expand every 5 minutes. on the dot." very, very good, thought provoking games (if you're into the whole metagame aspect of it).
i'd like to thank spellcheck for making this drunk poast possible.
I watched episode 100 about a week ago and found it very interesting. Also have seen some of the team monobattles as well as a few other funday mondays. The carrier rush day actually turned out to be a viable build.
sometimes i just find it fun to try these absurd builds out - results in some absurdly fun games.
Like the HuK mothership rush?Quote:
Originally Posted by sketch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbSodiGyABg
You know what works surprisingly well in 3v3? Mass scv rush. :P
No joke...teamed up with some friends and won four or five matches in a row in under 5 minutes. Trick is to leave your scv that you're building, get your other scvs to gather one bit of minerals, then rush with at least one other person and go wipe out as much economy as possible. Worse case scenario you shut down their economy temporarily while you continue to collect minerals (their teammates send their scvs/probes to defend), best case scenario, you shut down at least one of them, possibly two, and the member of your team that stayed out of the scv rush can by then rush whatever's left of their team.
So I decided to begin online play and started doing practice games Wednesday. Steamrolled the first two players I got before I stopped for the night, so I decided the next night I'd just dive into ladder play. I did my 5 placement games last night and got put in the Gold league which I'm proud of considering I only started playing a month ago. With a little practice I hope to jump to Diamond league. I just need to work on teching. My short game is great but my transitioning to mid- and long-game leaves a lot to be desired.
what race(s) do you guys play?
terran is definitely my strongest, although my protoss game isn't that bad. zerg is definitely my weakest game.
i do like to ladder a lot for 1v1, but 2v2 is definitely my favorite. there's a lot more metagame going on in that than in 1v1, 3v3 & 4v4 IMO
i thought i'd love the protoss when i started playing SC1. then i realized that they were vulnerable to both EMP adn plague AT THE SAME TIME. it's like the worst of all possible worlds.
terrans in sc1 were my favorite. i could beat the torrasque on the veteran campaign by going apeshit with siege tanks.
...maybe they'll drop the price on sc2....someday.
I can't believe I still haven't played this... Should I start?!
Deeefinitely :DQuote:
Originally Posted by J_Parker
GET THE FUCK OUT.Quote:
Originally Posted by J_Parker
but no, seriously, yes. buy the game, enjoy the single player (great story), but the multiplayer is really where you get your value out of the game.
For those of you struggling with defending a 4 gate in PvP, here's a good video by Artosis. Such a baller:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bb_X8Jlfj5g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bb_X8Jlfj5g
Going to bump this in case more people started playing. When I get back up to my place I'll add you, sketch.
Here's my profile. I started in Gold but dropped to Silver after a string of losses to cheese that I didn't know how to handle at the time.
Valdarith - StarCraft II
I'm getting a lot better and I'm on a pretty nice streak right now. The matchmaking system has been putting me against favored opponents for the past 20 games or so and I've won about 70% of them, so hopefully I'll be promoted soon.
I play Protoss exclusively, though Zerg intrigues me greatly. I'd like to get good at random but I don't think I have enough time to master three races.
My favorite builds as Protoss are:
vs Protoss - 3 gate/1 robo build. I find that 90% of my Protoss opponents at this level try to 4 gate. 3 gate/1 robo is a very strong counter to this if you scout and macro properly. You should be pumping out an Immortal immediately after the robo starts and chronoboosting the hell out of it. If you hold off the 4 gate rush you are pretty much guaranteed to win since you simply throw down a Robo Bay to get Colossi after his push. After you get 3 Colossi out you should be able to push his base and win with ease as he will have only 1 or 2 Colossi defending if you macro properly.
vs Zerg - Blink Stalker rush. This works extremely well, especially if Zerg fast expands. If the initial Stalker rush fails I like going with a Stargate to pump out Phoenixes for harass. They are so OP vs Zerg.
vs Terran - I will either 4 gate him or go for a long, macro-oriented game on him depending on his actions in the early game. If he attempts to turtle and tech, I will 4 gate. If he decides to go mass bio I open with a standard 3 gate/robo build and expand. After expansion, I throw down two Forges and a Twilight Council and begin chronoboosting upgrades like crazy. If I can get 2/2 with Charge and Blink by the time midgame is wrapping up, I usually do pretty well against MMM pushes.
awesome. i like how you actually rely on scouting - not enough players do that. they blindly build units and get mad when they lose (it typically so happens that their opponents scout them and then build the appropriate units to win). i find that most PvP matches that i see always end up in 4-gate vs 4-gate, whoever gets that immortal out first really has a major advantage....it tanks so well against standard gateway units and destroys stalkers.
i typically play terran and dabble in brotoss, occasionally play zerg or random in 4v4 randoms (somehow i'm in gold for that)
currently i'm gold, platinum, gold, gold (1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4) on my main account - saw that sc2 was on sale on amazon for $40 so i grabbed a 2ns copy for a smurf account, placed into diamond (1v1) & silver (2v2 - with the same partner i'm platinum with lol)
I like to scout a lot but I find that my macro drops when I do it, so I need to work on that a little more. I also tend to not be aggressive enough and at times that has cost me the game. I need to be more confident and recognize when I have a distinct advantage.
I've been doing this new zerg build for a week or two now. It doesn't make sense until you play it. Ling, infestor, brood lord. I know wtf right? But it rapes marine/tank, any roach builds, and any stalker/col build. Which is what most people play these days atleast at my level.
The awesome thing about it, is how synergistic infestors and brood lords are. Brood lords have extremely long range, and if you can hold a group or army inside your range with fungal growth but outside of theirs, they're army is fucked. And you aren't taking any losses.
As zerg, it is almost impossible to deal with rine tank viking (and perhaps 1 raven) with: lings, roaches, mutas, hydras, any zerg unit. EXCEPT broodlord and corruptor. Your broodlord shoots a broodling down to the siege/rine. All the siege tanks then either unsiege, or shoot at the broodling taking the marine ball or siege tank with it. Suddenly the siege tanks are useless and you can bring in your speedlings to mop up the fleeing force.
The hardest part about this build is surviving until you get the first infestors out, which is like 6-7 mins. Most rushes come around 6 so it's tough to fend off with just lings. The solution is to put a ling/drone at their ramp and start pumping lings, and a crawler or two when you see that they are on their way. And ofcourse stop droning until you know you can make his army leave you alone.
Here's the build I use:
9 ovie
11 scout
15 pool
15 gas
15 ovie
3 drones on gas when finished
17 queen
first 100 gas get ling speed
inject when queen finishes
23 expand
22 OL
8 lings to 26 supply
second 100 gas get lair
8 lings every injection, drones/OL otherwise
queen/drone when expo finishes
infestor pit when lair finishes
infestor energy upgrade as soon as infestation pit finishes
3 infestors at 35/80 energy upgrade.
hive
attack speed
spire
evo chamber and constant meelee/armor upgrades
2-3 more infestors
in-base hatch/queen for lings
greater spire
dump gas on 5 corruptors
2-3 BL when greater spire finishes
more corruptors if he has air-to-air units.
continue to mass while you contain him to two bases. You can take the ramp when you have 5-6 broodlords, with infestors to fungal up with sight to kill any units. When the wall is down rush in with lings to each expo to kill workers and it's gg.
3rd and 4th expo when first and second mineral lines start depleting.
Another nice thing is that your tech line is very smooth, you don't feel like your hive upgrade went to waste, or your infestation pit. And you have the gas for it with the extra gas you naturally have from massing lings. And when you get dropped or mutaed you have a gas and a mineral dump to fix the disparage in minerals or gas. Any cheese play like banshees mutas phenixes or dts get handled nicely by infestors with most of the time no losses.
I can post some good replays if anyone wants, although I'm on break at work so i can't right now. Everyone I play against is usually high diamond, or top ranked plat.
venik - StarCraft II
Feel free to add me for 2s/3s/custom games/youvsme or questions.
I've been watching a lot of Zerg pros recently and I have to say I really like spanishiwa's style the most. I really think mass queen builds are the future of Zerg metagame. Only very recently has the power of infuse been realized.
spanishiwa's style is awesome. a few weeks or so before he exploded on the replay scene (HD, husky, day9, etc.) i started doing a marine "rush" play - i'd got out a lot of marines fast, attack early, and win. pretty close to TLO's 7 rax attack but a bit more smooth. i'm pumping out 1 marine at each barracks and 1 SCV at all points in time, and consistently building more barracks as my minerals allowed it. no gas until about 28-35 supply depending on the matchup/map. it was weakest vs protoss, but still a good opening. i refined that into a defended FE build: 2-3 bunkers filled with marines a the choke for my natural allowing me to get 30 supply relatively fast, 2 orbcomms with decently saturated mineral lines. drop 4 gas all together, gas income sky rockets. first factory, stim and level 1 bio attack all finish by the 8-9 minute mark. depending on matchup/map, combat shield, tech to vikings, etc. etc.
Yea spanishwa is fun to watch, I like queen builds because they cost as much as a gateway/barracks which we don't need so it only seems natural to make 2-3 queens per expo/hatch.
I win in diamond vs people with 100+ with a 65 average apm. I guess it's more about how efficient you are with those actions. Granted 1 action a second isn't too slow.
Here's two replays with the fungal/broodlord build in 1v1 one vs zerg and one vs protoss
Shakuras Plateau - venik vs. jzo - Replays - SC2Replayed.com
This is a rank 23 diamond protoss, he went chargelot hightemplar and mixed in some dt harrass.
Metalopolis - venik vs. ilUvMiN - Replays - SC2Replayed.com
This is a rank 15 diamond zerg, he went roach/infestor
My APM hangs around 55-60 average. I know you can get to diamond with that. I never understood people incessantly clicking around to artificially increase their APM. It's wasted actions and IMO all of that time used adds up. There would be no need for all that clicking if you could hit your target the first time. I believe Day[9] talks about this in one of his Newbie Tuesday casts.
I need some character codes! Can't add friends without them. :(
just add me via email address. gmail: sketch2186Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTyla
On APM, i can't see anything higher than perhaps maybe 90-120 MAX (and that's stretching it, IMO) being useful. especially in early game when you're making only workers. i have no idea how you get up to 438 APM making workers only. i can see APM spiking when you're scouting, dropping your first rax/gateway, back to scouting, making another worker, back to scouting/worker harass (love killing that terran worker building the rax with my scouting probe), etc.
My character code is 293, name is venik.
Yea I think my APM is actually highest while telling my first OLs where to go and switching between hatch and scout and larvae and drone just checking for new larvae while i scout.
I beat a diamond Zerg a few days ago with my blink Stalker build. I think that build is super strong right now for me, but definitely has room for improvement.
I'm winning about 70% of my games vs. Protoss and Zerg. I really need work against Terran though. I'm probably only winning 30-40% of those games. I am getting constantly owned by MMM balls and it's rather frustrating the amount of flexibility that build offers to Terran. When I do beat MMM it's usually with a fast expand build with a 2/2 gateway upgrade timing push. However, I've also lost with this a few times, mainly to early Marine pushes that harm my economy in the early game and leave me struggling to catch up. At this point I'm guessing the best way to deal with this is to go with more Colossi mid-game and not rush so quickly to High Templar.
I also lose quite a bit to turtle-teching Terran. It's like their main is impenetrable and I can do nothing to keep them from massing Cattlebruisers and owning me. Last time I tried surrounding his main and using Feedback with my High Templar but there were just so many of them that it didn't matter. Not too sure what to do about this except to maybe focus more on Stargate tech to counter with Void Rays. Stargate units should add some extra mobility and therefore allow me to expand around the map more boldly.
I got promoted to Gold league on Friday after winning 7 straight games. I was surprised that I was placed in the #3 spot in my new league. I was previously #1 in Silver and did have a lot of points. How does the system decide how you fall into your new league? Is it MMR-based?
I've been tearing ass lately. I can definitely tell my play is a lot more solid but I still need work on my macro, particularly late-game. My three main builds are really solid right now and I've been able to figure out how to handle Terran MMM blobs so my rating has gone up accordingly.
Next stop, Platinum. :D
I've seen a couple of you on a few times but you're always mid-game when I log in. I'll try to send a message sometime.
Congrats, dude. I placed somewhere in the 40s when I got promoted to gold, pushed my way down to the 11-13 range in my league. I saw you on recently, but you were campaigning and I didn't want to interrupt.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTyla
i just saw this post:
uber turtling terran? mass expand. If you're scouting properly (observers, suiciding a probe to their front, etc.) and often enough you should know when you're safe to expand - grab two or 3 more bases (putting you up to 4 or 5). If it's 2-base vs 2-base, and my opponent is going uber turtle (as is often my early-game as a terran), I'll immediately drop 2-3 more bases. the economy provided by that can really, REALLY propel you far enough ahead to win. I can easily transition to mainy factory & starport tech (or robo & stargate)Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTyla
Yeah I figured that out about a week ago and saw my results against these types of players skyrocket! Now I need to focus more on defending drops. I've been throwing a few more Observers into my unit composition to look out for this. Medivacs are just really obscene.Quote:
Originally Posted by sketch
I rarely ever go with Stargates and that tends to hurt me against drop-type players. I lean toward mass gates and Robo tech. I LOVE blink Stalkers but they don't provide as much mobility as a few Phoenixes flying around the map would.