DeMotivators

I like the 3 different death toll quotes on a single page...

If it was indeed shot down, the Russians are were probably involved somehow, either shooting it down themselves on accident, or providing the SA-11 to the separatists. MANPADS cant get halfway to FL330.

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Originally Posted by Vantage

If it was indeed shot down, the Russians are were probably involved somehow, either shooting it down themselves on accident, or providing the SA-11 to the separatists. MANPADS cant get halfway to FL330.

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Well the separatists did over run a couple military installations, didn't they? They likely wouldn't know how to work the equipment though without training and access to the systems.

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Originally Posted by NickS VR4

Well the separatists did over run a couple military installations, didn't they? They likely wouldn't know how to work the equipment though without training and access to the systems.

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Originally Posted by Vantage

If it was indeed shot down, the Russians are were probably involved somehow, either shooting it down themselves on accident, or providing the SA-11 to the separatists. MANPADS cant get halfway to FL330.

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A MANPADS is fairly easy to operate. Al-Qai'da has written fairly decent handbooks on it's operation (early generation MANPADS) that are available if you look online hard enough.

But a MANPADS would not get to FL330 on their own. It depends what kind of terrain the aircraft was over. If the terrain was high enough, then a MANPADS could reach.

I really don't see what Russia would gain from this at all and I sincerely doubt they would provide an SA-11 to separatists. Maybe some MANPADS, but I doubt an SA-11.

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Originally Posted by RealMcCoy

I was a few years later, I was paying 55-60 cents. I don't think you would have been very happy with the 5:13s unless you had some really tall street tires. My G60s with 4:88s had me almost floating the valves up top. I think that motor lived at 7200 RPM most days...

I had a Schneider hydraulic cam that was ground for the application. (my boss at the time was big into fast boats, and had them on speed dial...) 850 double pumper, Torker manifold, (Those old BBC torkers that turned the carb sideways were the shit back then... LOL ) 4:88 gears, and a switch-pitch TH400. (electrical switch on the shifter would switch it between 1900 or 3000 RPM stall...) All stuffed in a ratty looking 64 Chevelle SS.

I always hear people claim that the price of gas isn't much different today when adjusted for inflation... I"d like those idiots to explain one small detail to me. When I was 14-16 years old working in gas stations for minimum wage or slightly over, (don't remember specifics, but I believe around $3.50ish) I could buy 6-7 gallons of fuel for one hour of my gross pay... Do the math on that today....

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Originally Posted by wingnut

I was even a bit later at ~75 cents with a 750 double pumper and M21 4 speed, off-shelf PAW cam (whatever happened to them) and the same dam torker square port manifold...which I still have on the shelf to this day :D

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Good God, I had a Torker as well; only single-plane I ever ran on the street. :rolleyes:

The square-port heads didn't make much down low, so I figured what-the-hell?

Larry, I ran N50-15s, and yeah, it screamed at highway speeds.

I drove it with open headers (2 1/8" primarys) for a month, and told everyone I loved it loud.

I didn't, but as a macho muscle-car owner there was an image to uphold. :D

A pretty good article: Malaysia Airlines plane crashes on Ukraine-Russia border - live - Telegraph

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Originally Posted by rlacasse1

A MANPADS is fairly easy to operate. Al-Qai'da has written fairly decent handbooks on it's operation (early generation MANPADS) that are available if you look online hard enough.

But a MANPADS would not get to FL330 on their own. It depends what kind of terrain the aircraft was over. If the terrain was high enough, then a MANPADS could reach.

I really don't see what Russia would gain from this at all and I sincerely doubt they would provide an SA-11 to separatists. Maybe some MANPADS, but I doubt an SA-11.

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Looks like Kiev's highest altitude is about 180m above sea level. Not nearly high enough.

Highest point in Ukraine is Hoverla mountain at 2061 m above sea level.

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Originally Posted by rlacasse1

A MANPADS is fairly easy to operate. Al-Qai'da has written fairly decent handbooks on it's operation that are available if you look online hard enough.

But a MANPADS would not get to FL330 on their own. It depends what kind of terrain the aircraft was over. If the terrain was high enough, then a MANPADS could reach.

I really don't see what Russia would gain from this at all and I sincerely doubt they would provide an SA-11 to separatists. Maybe some MANPADS, but I doubt an SA-11.

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The highest peak in the Ukraine is 6762' above sea level so at best, with the latest and great MANPADS out there, they would barely be scraping FL200. I don' think Russia would have anything to gain, but what did they have to gain when they shot down KAL007? Whoever did it, probably confused it with a Ukrainian military transport. And again, this is all predicated on the assumption that it was indeed shot down.

If that's the highest terrain then the MANPADS are definitely out, at least older generations, the newer stuff could get well over FL200 off a 6k ft peak. And you're absolutely right Vantage, it's all about whether it was shot down in the first place.

Personally, I believe Ukraine would have the most to gain out of an aircraft, especially civilian, being "shot down" (True or not) over their territory.

"18.27 Our Brussels correspondent, Bruno Waterfield, has just sent across the official Ukrainian response to the crash."

"A large passenger aircraft Boeing 777, performing a flight between Amsterdam and Kuala Lumpur, was shot down in the eastern part of Ukraine. According to the General Staff of Ukrainian Armed Forces, the airplane was shot down by the Russian Buk missile system as the liner was flying at an altitude of 10,000 meters."