Carbon Fiber Drive Shafts

[J-Groove]

I know it has been asked on 3Si, and heck I could do a search, but I figure we should build the content here. :)

I know for drag racing, the lighter rotating mass of a carbon fiber drive shaft is probably a must.

But for me, being that I want to build a fun clean reliable '99 VR-4 (not going to drag race her, she will be on collector's insurance soon and that is a HUGE no no for them) I'll build her to 13T, maybe bump it up to 19T in the future but I'll be staying TD04.

Is a carbon fiber drive shaft worth the expense on a car that will not see the drag strip or anything beyond the non competitive track day?

-John

[Vantage]

In since I've been wondering the same thing myself.

[i3igpete]

i would say no, unless you're a drifter and need the lighter drivetrain inertia to break the tires loose easier. otherwise since your tires don't slip and the CFDS is a long slender tube (not much rotational inertia to be saved), you're better off spending the money otherwise. yes, i do own one but i'm pretty much near the end of easy weight savings.

[Atrosity]

Is it even worth it if your car is putting down a decent amount of power?

[pos-vr4]

I have 2 3s at the shop now, one has ACPT 2pc, the other is ACPT 1 pc, i have put a few hours driving on both cars and I think they are a great upgrade.

Id recommend a drive shaft VS a light weight flywheel.

The 2 pc car had the original rear metal shaft, and i replaced the rear carrier bearing last week, now the car is as smooth as butter.

For me simplicity is king, so removing carrier bearings is a great thing to do. And saving some weight is a plus as well.

if the rest of the car is cherry, do it.

[Polygon]

No, but I would say an aluminum 2 PC DS is worth it. They're a lot cheaper and only a tiny bit heavier.

[UTRacerX9]

I have 2 3s at the shop now, one has ACPT 2pc, the other is ACPT 1 pc, i have put a few hours driving on both cars and I think they are a great upgrade.

Id recommend a drive shaft VS a light weight flywheel.

The 2 pc car had the original rear metal shaft, and i replaced the rear carrier bearing last week, now the car is as smooth as butter.

For me simplicity is king, so removing carrier bearings is a great thing to do. And saving some weight is a plus as well.

if the rest of the car is cherry, do it.

Ditto, I have the PST 1 piece. It's extremely lightweight compared to stock, and it makes it a LOT easier to break the tires loose, which is actually a good thing, as it saves your clutch, tranny, and TC from abuse.

There is one kinda bad thing I'll mention, but possibly this is just in my case. No, I'm not talking about the vibration issues that some people have had. I'm talking about the on/off switch my car has become. I have a lightweight flywheel, wheels, hood, CFDS, underdrive pulley, various weight reduction, 13T's and supporting mods. When driving, I am either accelerating or decelerating. It is extremely quick to change from either, so cruising is not as "smooth" as it used to be, the car behaves more like a racecar in that aspect now. It's still a very fun car to drive, but you just don't find yourself cruising at one speed very long.

EDIT: I see you're in Rowlett now. I won't be able to make the Texas gathering coming up, but I've moved back to TX and as soon as everything is settled, we can have another meet and I'll give you a ride in my car and you can see how it feels vs stock.

[J-Groove]

Great feedback in this thread!

If anything it seems more like a down the road type of thing if I ever do it.


No, but I would say an aluminum 2 PC DS is worth it. They're a lot cheaper and only a tiny bit heavier.

I was wondering if that was an option. I just jumped on IPS and only saw carbon fiber ones, I've never looked into them since I was FWD.

Since weight isn't a HUGE thing a aluminum one would be a great bet.




EDIT: I see you're in Rowlett now. I won't be able to make the Texas gathering coming up, but I've moved back to TX and as soon as everything is settled, we can have another meet and I'll give you a ride in my car and you can see how it feels vs stock.

That would be awesome! Welcome back to Texas, what area are you at?

-John

[UTRacerX9]

Plano.

[J-Groove]

Well you're real close then. I will defiantly have to take you up on your offer.

Your Stealth has always been one of my favorite cars. You need to bring her out to the next Cars and Coffee.

-John

[Polygon]

I was wondering if that was an option. I just jumped on IPS and only saw carbon fiber ones, I've never looked into them since I was FWD.

Since weight isn't a HUGE thing a aluminum one would be a great bet.

-John

Not just price, but I've heard of people having vibration issues with the 1pc CF DS. I would suggest that you go with a 2pc whether you go with CF or aluminum.

[pos-vr4]

I have never driven a car with aluminum shafts, but im sure that would be a great alternative.

I have never driven a car with a PST shaft so i cannot comment about their product, but i worked at a shop that was a ACPT dealer and we never had ANY complaints of vibration related issues on anything from 3s, DSMs or Euro cars.

And frankly the Euro guys were WAY harder on there cars VS the rest of the customer base, and the pickiest, nit-picking twat waffles of all!

[Polygon]

It's seems to be really hit or miss on the vibration with the CF shaft. Some people have problems for some reason. I'd sure like to know the cause.

[wraith]

I was one of the very first to get one in my car and I still rate mine as one of the best mods I could have done. Here is what I can do that I could not do before. I can just lift my foot off the clutch at 700rpms and the car goes without stalling. It feels like a lighter car all around and the clunk is gone or practically non-existant.
Its strong too and can take snow/ice etc with no degredation.

Sam

[MR2]

the one piece CF is soo expensive, even the second hand guys can't get a whole lot for them...two piece ALU is the right price though :)

[Gene]

i would say no, unless you're a drifter and need the lighter drivetrain inertia to break the tires loose easier. otherwise since your tires don't slip and the CFDS is a long slender tube (not much rotational inertia to be saved), you're better off spending the money otherwise. yes, i do own one but i'm pretty much near the end of easy weight savings.
i disagree. i've driven cars with similar setups besides the driveshaft and i saw a NOTICEABLE difference with a CFDS. the car feels a bit peppier overall.
a more pronounced difference will be noticed if you're going from worn out carrier bearings to a solid CFDS.

[The Dimer]

I'd say two piece aluminum is definately the way to go, at least if you're going two piece. I was on 3SX looking at them and the descriptions make it look like the aluminum is actually lighter than the carbon fiber one, if only by half a pound.

From 3SX:
Carbon Fiber - 27 pounds for the 2-piece kit (not counting the included carrier bearing)
Aluminum - The 26.5 pound weight is without the carrier bearing.

$800 vs $1400, I think I know my choice.

[SilverJester]

I can just lift my foot off the clutch at 700rpms and the car goes without stalling.Sam
I've got an ACPT 1 piece and noticed this also. Honestly I didn't notice a huge difference overall though. The clunking was gone, that was the first thing I noticed. I had a slight vibration around 65-70mph but it's gone now that I installed solid motor mounts.

[SkortchGT]

totally worth it to buy a 1pc cfds. the only downfall is some cars will have a vibration with the 1pc, others won't. it's just car specific. i have the vibration problem with mine, had to turn it 3 times to get it where it's acceptable, even though it is still there a little bit around 80mph, then just kinda goes away.

[SkortchGT]

totally worth it to buy a 1pc cfds. the only downfall is some cars will have a vibration with the 1pc, others won't. it's just car specific. i have the vibration problem with mine, had to turn it 3 times to get it where it's acceptable, even though it is still there a little bit around 80mph, then just kinda goes away.

i forgot to mention i also bought mine used but in very good condition, was going to send it to pst to get re-balanced before i put it on but never did.

[Mikes2nd]

I have the PST 1 piece CF full and the front half on my other car(ACPT from Dynamic Racing).

No vibration in any form.

BOTH make a HUGE difference on drivability. I won't own a 3s without one.

Its better all around, no more 40lbs rotating mass, your car is 20% better across the board. No more worry about driveshaft bushings... no more worry about it breaking, lower revs when pulling away from a stop light/sign. Quicker acceleration, lighter car...

Whats not to love? If you can get one used, get one. If you can afford the 1000$ i think its a great bang for your buck.

Daily driver? A must? Nothing is a must. Just you'll enjoy driving the car by 15-20%.

I can pop my clutch at like 800 rpm and it takes off.

[songsay ratana]

Hey Mikes2nd, I think I tried to buy your carbon fiber shaft from you at one time many many years ago.
Well I went with a used two piece ACPT. In my opinion, getting rid of that lobro joint was the best part of having the carbon shaft.

[ChargerX3]

I have had my PST 1 piece since I bought my red TT a while back. It has always vibrated and rotating it doesnt solve the issue. I also swapped it into my other stealth and the only thing that changed was the mph at which it vibrates. People say its motor mounts, but mine are in good/great condition. I even had the thing balanced again just to make sure. I now have stock drive shafts in both of my cars. Yes, the car has more off the line power with the CFDS, but once you get out of 1st you hardly notice a difference. High speed crusing is also much better with the stock shaft. If you are looking to drag race then its a good idea, but lighter wheels might be an even better option IMO.

[MR2]

anyone tried taking them to a shop and seeing about balancing?

[DanF]

Wow, are they $1400 now? I seem to recall that they were $900 on PST's original group buy way back in the day. I love mine :)

[fullracegt]

hey,i kno this is an old thread but i was just wondering if anyone has recently purchased a pst 1piece cfds and had any vibration issues?


-matt

[FeaRpb]

ACPT CF Drive Shaft
ACPT Carbon Fiber Driveshaft Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4- TREADSTONE PERFORMANCE (http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/product.phtml?p=1209&prodname=ACPT+Carbon+Fiber+Driveshaft++Mitsubishi+ +3000GT+VR4)

[TurboSinceBirth]

I've ran about 4 of them both ACPT and PST in 1-piece and 2-piece varieties. I've never had an issue with vibration as long as the rest of my drivetrain parts weren't worn. I've had motor mounts, rear diff bushings, excessive diff backlash/preload, transfercase slop especially in the tailshaft bearing, and worn splines all cause vibration. Once those things were fixed there was zero issues. The stock driveshaft and carrier bearings just mask necessary maintenance that needs to be done on every single 3S. Anyone that has vibration issues doesn't understand exactly why and blames it on the shaft itself. Having it rebalanced again should be enough to conclude something is wrong with your car.

[fullracegt]

ACPT CF Drive Shaft
ACPT Carbon Fiber Driveshaft Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4- TREADSTONE PERFORMANCE (http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/product.phtml?p=1209&prodname=ACPT+Carbon+Fiber+Driveshaft++Mitsubishi+ +3000GT+VR4)

Yeah I came across that but I wasnt sure if it was a full length 1 peice shaft or just the front section

[fullracegt]

I've ran about 4 of them both ACPT and PST in 1-piece and 2-piece varieties. I've never had an issue with vibration as long as the rest of my drivetrain parts weren't worn. I've had motor mounts, rear diff bushings, excessive diff backlash/preload, transfercase slop especially in the tailshaft bearing, and worn splines all cause vibration. Once those things were fixed there was zero issues. The stock driveshaft and carrier bearings just mask necessary maintenance that needs to be done on every single 3S. Anyone that has vibration issues doesn't understand exactly why and blames it on the shaft itself. Having it rebalanced again should be enough to conclude something is wrong with your car.

Yea that's more what I was thinking too,that the vibration issue was more related to mileage&maintenance

[NOMIEZVR4]

im gonna buy mine from ips. 765 for a 1 pc aluminum ds

[anyonebutme]

Keep in mind the "1 piece" DSS aluminum is actually a 2-piece. It bolts to the stock rear section.

[green-lantern]

I've ran about 4 of them both ACPT and PST in 1-piece and 2-piece varieties. I've never had an issue with vibration as long as the rest of my drivetrain parts weren't worn. I've had motor mounts, rear diff bushings, excessive diff backlash/preload, transfercase slop especially in the tailshaft bearing, and worn splines all cause vibration. Once those things were fixed there was zero issues. The stock driveshaft and carrier bearings just mask necessary maintenance that needs to be done on every single 3S. Anyone that has vibration issues doesn't understand exactly why and blames it on the shaft itself. Having it rebalanced again should be enough to conclude something is wrong with your car.

Great post

[green-lantern]

im gonna buy mine from ips. 765 for a 1 pc aluminum ds

I'm running this one and happy with it. It's a little more but it replaces the entire shaft.

PST Aluminum/Steel Hybrid 2-piece Driveshaft for AWD TT/VR4*-*Mitsubishi 3000GT*/*Dodge Stealth Parts (http://www.3sx.com/store/comersus_viewItemBundle.asp?idProduct=643)

[NOMIEZVR4]

hmm...scratch that. I want a 1 piece only. no more carrier bearings

[green-lantern]

Pretty sure you will be buying carbon fiber then.

[R/T93]

No one makes a 1 pc alum, it would have to be 5" for the critical point to be high enough.

[Permanent grin]

I bought a 1 piece cfds from PST (albeit a custom one) and have run it up to 167 mph actual trap speed without any hint of an issue or vibration.

André

[R/T93]

My 3.5" 2 section Driveshaft Shop Alum one has been great, good up to 145 so far.

[fullracegt]

My 3.5" 2 section Driveshaft Shop Alum one has been great, good up to 145 so far.

Is that a full length shaft?

[R/T93]

My 3.5" 2 section Driveshaft Shop Alum one has been great, good up to 145 so far.

From TC to rear carrier bearing mount is 1 piece, then uses a stock rear section. Upgraded the U-joints to serviceable and replaceable Spicer units.