6g74 / built atx

[n2nsanity]

A slight change of plans from what I was originally looking to do, but this sounds a little more unique, and it's going to save me quite a bit of time, so I'm gonna go with it.

About a week or so ago I ran across a good deal on a green atx 94 sl with 90k miles. It supposedly has with a shift kit, high stall tq converter and lsd along with a few other extras. It also had the removable sunroof, so I was happy about that. The engine in this was blown, making it much more affordable. And I just finished getting my 3.5 ready, so this was good timing. Anyway as soon as I got it home, I went to work on it.

http://i55.tinypic.com/iclil3.jpg

came with some custom headers/downpipe too
http://i51.tinypic.com/ay0hhg.jpg

if you're wondering why it has a boost gauge, it had a supercharger, but that was gone when i picked it up. it does still have the safc tho
http://i54.tinypic.com/a32lck.jpg

first order of business was to swap out those wheels
http://i56.tinypic.com/14lrrec.jpg

[n2nsanity]

Here's my 3.5, just sitting there waiting on a new home
http://i55.tinypic.com/3445dgh.jpg

Here's my makeshift battery relocation kit. It's actually an amp kit, but its supposed to be 0 gauge and it ended up only costing me like 20 shipped, so I couldn't resist. I held the ground wire up next to the front springs and its the same size, lol
http://i55.tinypic.com/30bfpcl.jpg

I had a few other upgrades, but since they were for the 5spd, so I can't use them yet.

[Ninja Performance]

Keep us updated with pics, let us know if you have any questions along the way!
Engine setup looks VERY clean.

-Chris

[n2nsanity]

#Prep for pulling old engine

disconnected battery
put shifter in neutral
ebrake on and wheelchock behind back tire
removed intake
locked neutral safety switch with an allen wrench in pinhole (neutral position)
disconnected shifter cable
removed battery tray and washer reservoir
removed hood, set on roof of car
jacked up front end, on 2 jack stands
front wheels off

[n2nsanity]

#More Prepwork For Removing Old Engine / Trans

unbolted struts
unbolted abs and brake lines for more slack
removed axles from spindles
removed ds axle from block and slid out of trans
removed starter
loosened trans bolts
loosened motor mounts / transmission mount
removed downpipe


unbolted strut
http://i52.tinypic.com/24d0gnp.jpg

ds axle, unbolt the block axle mount and slide the axle out
http://i56.tinypic.com/156z8k4.jpg

[n2nsanity]

#More Prepwork For Removing Old Engine / Trans

jacked up engine slightly
disconnected fuel lines, should have used an oil pan to catch it
drained radiator to jug (drain cock in bottom front driver side)
disconnected rad hoses
disconnected atx lines from rad, drain in pan, maybe should drain from atx also?
disconnected ps hoses, drain in pan
disconnected rad fan connectors
disconnected alt/ac connectors
disconnected a/c lines
disconnected trans connectors, spd sensor

[n2nsanity]

#More Prepwork For Removing Old Engine / Trans

removed upper mani for easier pull
wrapped a tow strap through front header and rear intake mani brackets
connected engine hoist and put light tension pulling up
removed motor mounts / trans mount
removed radiator for more room
any loose lines were pulled out of engine bay and tied back

[n2nsanity]

#Pulling Old Engine / Trans

pulled out at 45* angle, engine side up, ps axle still attached

http://i56.tinypic.com/s12lba.jpg

http://i53.tinypic.com/ddgg15.jpg

[n2nsanity]

#ATX Swap

removed trans bolts, much easier as they were loosened earlier
removed trans from 3.0
removed tq conv access plate (bottom center of block)
loosened tq conv bolts (locking crank pulley helps, but better to do this before removing from car while wheels are still on ground.)
removed tq conv from 3.0
installed tq conv on 3.5 (i'd also recommend not tightening them all the way til the eng/trans back in car and wheels on ground. and use thread lock)
lined up 3.5/trans (atx flat on dolley, 3.5 on hoist
shaft lines up like this ( \ \ ) looking from passenger side
slid atx onto 3.5
installed trans to block bolts
ready to go


it's pink, lol
http://i53.tinypic.com/2s9r37r.jpg

access plate removed
http://i53.tinypic.com/14eb77b.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/dms29u.jpg

[n2nsanity]

#Dropping 3.5 / Trans In

sealed up all loose hose ends with plastic wrap and tape
cleaned engine bay with some degreaser
installed new poly motor mounts (this is the best time to do this btw)
3.5 / trans in air, passenger side axle and trans angled down 45* (definitely a 2 person job)
slowly lowered engine / trans in


new mounts
http://i55.tinypic.com/vcuuy0.jpg

http://i56.tinypic.com/29asev5.jpg

nothing like a midnight engine swap
http://i55.tinypic.com/2vj4e86.jpg

[IPD]

awesome. those wheels look like the one's predacon had on his vr4; only painted black.

let me knwo what the stall is on it when you find out...and how much you like/dislike it. any idea what LSD it's got? quaife?

[n2nsanity]

#Installation

connected ac lines, new orings
installed alternator that came with the 3.5, cleaned/shined it up a few weeks ago
installed radiator
connected atx rad lines
connected rad fan connectors
connected starter
connected ac, alt wires
alternator power connector was bigger, not sure why. swapped power wire cover and drilled out wire clip hole a little bigger, plug was same
odd, alt is same part#, but some slight differences

[n2nsanity]

#Finalizing Installation

the 3.5 rear harness attached to the upper mani only had 2 pins, my wire harness had 3 pins (ps, oil, knock sensor?)
swapped for the 3 pin harness, reloomed and taped, knock? sensor just disconnected now, will swap from 3.0 block later (wish i would have caught this with both engines out the car :( would make this much easier)
installed stock downpipe and cat from my 94 base (fed spec) with new gaskets
no need for spacers, it fit fine, but maybe because my 3.5 came with exh mani, they look same size, but maybe are somehow a little taller or angled differently
swapped out the 3.5 upper mani with the 3.0, looks more stock and is partially polished
can't find my fed spec tb, so old ca spec one is on
wired up the (ca spec) rear o2 sensor connector to the (fed spec) pre cat o2 sensor, front connector is still open
topped off atf, only needed to add 2 qts so far, castrol import multi veh, said is good for diamond spIII
changed oil & filter valv synth 5w30 and fram xtra guard
battery relocation isn't done yet, battery sitting on frame and temporarily connected for testing

[n2nsanity]

#First Test

started up pretty easily
something started squealing, maybe crankcase pressure, more likely from plenum
also, some smoke from downpipe, probably from spills on it
no cel so far

[n2nsanity]

#Things still unfinished

fix squeal/leak
battery relocation
washer relocation
knock sensor
clean up loosely connected stuff
install hood
connect sprayers
mount hood light, replace with brighter leds?
check on ds poly mount, doesnt fit

A few other things I'd like to do before I get this car on the road
good trans flush / filter, gasket change, and fill with actual oem diamond spIII or maybe some royal purple
add a separate trans cooler
install my mtx radiator or maybe a new obx or 3sx one
interior swap
fix front bumper and ps side skirt

[n2nsanity]

Keep us updated with pics, let us know if you have any questions along the way!
Engine setup looks VERY clean.

-Chris

thanks, it's pretty much done
i was too busy doing all the work to come post about it, lol
i regret not taking more pictures, but i do have a quite a few
and there were several things i got hung up on, but i dont recall anyone mentioning those issues, the only things they mentioned, were either common sense simple stuff or weren't even an issue for me

[n2nsanity]

awesome. those wheels look like the one's predacon had on his vr4; only painted black.

let me knwo what the stall is on it when you find out...and how much you like/dislike it. any idea what LSD it's got? quaife?

thanks, they're my favorite set i've ever owned, could use a good cleaning, but that will come soon enough

i don't know much about atx's, but i'll update with some results soon and any other info i come across
i've done several filter/gasket/flushes on other vehicles, but not much work with the 3/s atx
the torque converter is pink, lol

[SOHC]

Those headers looked ugly and not mandrel bent you know what brand they are (look like RIPP to me but not sure)?

[n2nsanity]

not sure, got the car from "tribute" on 3si
i'd have to check with him

theyre not the prettiest, shouldve been ceramic coated or something
they do look much better flowing than stock, the downpipe that came with them does too

i'm using the stock 3.5 manifolds and borrowing the stock downpipe and cat from my other car
after my new downpipe and hiflow cat get here, i'll put those back on the other car

[n2nsanity]

#Second test

started up again, still a squeal
took the bolts from the rear plenum brackets out (they were pulling back on the plenum as they were designed for the 3.5 mani)
i guess it was pulling just enough to allow the slightest leak, was a really loud whistling sound
then after retightening the front/center plenum bolts, the squeal went away

now on to test the trans (this didn't go so well)
went through all the gears to try to get the fluid circulated, but nothing was happening
its like the torque converter isnt even trying to engage
left it in neutral and running and checked/added another quart of fluid which brought it up to the full/hot line
it was getting pretty late, so i just turned it off and called it a night



#Third test
next day, did the same thing
ran through gears and added another quart
it's now reading full, but still not working
i'm hoping theres something just not connected or loose somewhere
i already checked all connectors on the trans and the entire engine bay for that matter. nothing unaccounted for
the only things unplugged are the 3rd and 4th o2 sensors, which i dont have on the car
and also the washer reservoir but that is removed

at least i have that squeal taken care of...

[92pearltt]

The torque converter locked in 3 times when you put it in the trans correct?

[n2nsanity]

this may be where i messed up
after i already had it all together, i found out i was supposed to install the tq converter to the trans 1st
i mounted it to the flex plate first
i installed same way i took it out, i shouldve read up on it first
guess i'm just used to mtx's

[n2nsanity]

and look what came in the mail today :)
wish it would have came a few days earlier
that way i could've done the exhaust only once
oh well, this thing is really light and it did give me a chance to see if the stock exhaust fits on a 3.5
now to see if this fits as well. hopefully it will have a little more clearance and not less at all
one thing i don't like from looking at it is the curve of the pipe from the rear manifold
it looks like it was put on backwards, so that the exhaust will flow from the rear head towards the exhaust from the front head

http://i54.tinypic.com/ir0vmv.jpg

[IPD]

and look what came in the mail today :)
wish it would have came a few days earlier
that way i could've done the exhaust only once
oh well, this thing is really light and it did give me a chance to see if the stock exhaust fits on a 3.5
now to see if this fits as well. hopefully it will have a little more clearance and not less at all
one thing i don't like from looking at it is the curve of the pipe from the rear manifold
it looks like it was put on backwards, so that the exhaust will flow from the rear head towards the exhaust from the front head

http://i54.tinypic.com/ir0vmv.jpg

ahhh....the ebay n/a downpipe. :)

all the more reason to get a tt conversion; the ebay tt downpipe is better; rivaling any of our platform shops' offerings.

[n2nsanity]

i'll try it at least
i'm going to try to get this and the battery relocation done today
tomorrow i should have more time to work on the transmission problems

[92pearltt]

Ya I was a little confused when you said you bolted the torque converter to the flex plate first. You have to drop it into the trans first.

[n2nsanity]

how do i seem to be the only person that didnt know this? lol

well i got the car all jacked up and sitting on stands
was about to put the new downpipe on when i noticed there was no o2 bung on the new downpipe
so thats on hold until later
also, upon further examination, the exhaust is touching, but just barely
i guess i didn't look at it from all angles last time
from the passenger side there is all kinds of room, which is where i was when i mounted it
from the driver side, its just barely touching the lip of the lower part of the oil pan where the upper/lower are mounted together
i worked more on routing the power cable for the battery relocation, but ran out of time
ground is done, but having trouble finding a good spot to route it along the passenger side floorboard because the wire is so thick
so, nothing accomplished today :(

maybe i shouldve just stuck with my original plan and did the mtx conversion
then i couldve sold the upgraded atx and had more funds to play with
if i dont have some luck with this trans soon, i'm going to do that
i really want to try out this route tho, i don't think anyone's done it yet

noone knows what the buzzing sound is? that was leading me to believe it was something electrical
and how likely is it that any damage has resulted from what ive done so far?

anyway, here is a pic of the exhaust
it could probably be bent slightly towards the passenger side and you might not need spacers
http://i56.tinypic.com/qn1c9u.jpg

[Jomojr]

I cant wait to see this finished. Dont count out your atx yet 8) I am alittle biased though. I am really interested in how this turns out.

[n2nsanity]

wow, long time no see
how's ga treating ya?

[IPD]

I cant wait to see this finished. Dont count out your atx yet 8) I am alittle biased though. I am really interested in how this turns out.

i know who i'm voting for ATX ROTM.... :)

just an fyi, i've ran that downpipe before. it worked just fine on my stock 3.0L n/a. probably doesn't have as much power as other types of downpipes...but you're not going to really notice the difference.

[Jomojr]

Loving it down here 8) Closer to the ATL and the Family in Jax Fl. Right now Im just missing my car. Should be out of the body shop in another week or two. Im really wanting to have it mostly done "mechanical" by BRG. You making it to BRG?

[n2nsanity]

will try to make it if the car is all done and i have any $ left, lol
will be at ng no matter what

[RL7]

Supposedly you can damage the torque converter or the atx shaft by running the atx like that, but you didn't drive around or anything so you should be ok. I think I had my torque converter installed wrong (not completely in) for a little bit and I did drive (a very little bit) on it. I did re-install it correctly and I haven't noticed any signs of damage. It is possible the squealing noises you heard could have been some damage happening though. Was there any fluid in the torque converter? Due to the way it works, it doesn't seem likely that the torque converter could prime itself.

[n2nsanity]

i couldnt drive if i wanted to, lol. it didnt budge in any gear
in all gears except neutral and reverse its making this faint buzzing sound (sounds electrical)
i intentionally left fluid in the tq converter, i didnt know if it could prime itself, so thought that was safer
i shouldve dumped it and poured new fluid in it
squealing noise was the plenum. i could tell it was definitely from the plenum or rear valve cover.
tightened the plenum bolts while it was running so that was definitely what fixed it

[TUFFTR]

That downpipe flow is definitely backwards! I would be getting in contact with the ebay seller right away....thats a worse design then factory!

[n2nsanity]

i had an idea what might be wrong
thought maybe the ground wasn't good enough
so i attached a nice thick ground wire from the trans directly to the battery
still no good
that wouldve been too easy, lol
weather isn't cooperating, so it looks like it will be another week before i get any more work done

this buzzing sound is really puzzling me
sounds like when youre trying to start a car with a dead battery
that real fast clicking sound, but much quieter

[whitedragon]

You will wish you stuck with your original plan and gone for the MTX.

[Ninja Performance]

You will wish you stuck with your original plan and gone for the MTX.

This

-Chris

[n2nsanity]

i may still go that route
i want to give the atx a 2nd shot at least
i dont like not knowing why something isnt working

[whitedragon]

i may still go that route
i want to give the atx a 2nd shot at least
i dont like not knowing why something isnt working

It doesn't matter if it's working or not. You will be annoyed at how "slow" it is with the ATX, how it doesn't shift when you want it to, and how it runs out of gearing so quick, and it never seems to be in the powerband.

My 3.5 with IPT's built ATX was still slow, the torque converter they gave me never seemed to work right, and it seemed to never shift at the right spot ever.

Creative had a 3.5 MTX and would regularly spank me, and that's even with my extensive exhaust mods and his stock downpipe and catback. Unless you are planning on having a wife or gf drive the car that can't drive a stick, ditch the ATX.

[IPD]

:rolleyes:

chris is going turncoat from the days of being a fan of the panda.

[SOHC]

What did it run in the 1/4?

[whitedragon]

What did it run in the 1/4?

Are you asking me?

At my car's fastest ever, it ran 15.7. It consistantly ran 15.8-16.2 every time down the track, regardless of what other mods I had, or how I was launching.

I went through several different exhaust setups, headers, manifold and downpipe, MSD DIS-4, and a few other things, and the car never ever went faster than 15.7.

It was pretty disappointing for the money I invested. I'd never do an ATX sports car ever again.

[SOHC]

Are you asking me?

At my car's fastest ever, it ran 15.7. It consistantly ran 15.8-16.2 every time down the track, regardless of what other mods I had, or how I was launching.

I went through several different exhaust setups, headers, manifold and downpipe, MSD DIS-4, and a few other things, and the car never ever went faster than 15.7.

It was pretty disappointing for the money I invested. I'd never do an ATX sports car ever again.


Yeah I meant to quote you.

Dang thats slower then I thought it would be do you remember what it trapped? Do you think ATX and MTX are about the same from a roll? I think it might be the first gear that messes up the ATX its too damn long.

If my trans goes you think it wold be cheaper to do a 5 speed swap or rebuild (around $2000).

[IPD]

Are you asking me?

At my car's fastest ever, it ran 15.7. It consistantly ran 15.8-16.2 every time down the track, regardless of what other mods I had, or how I was launching.

I went through several different exhaust setups, headers, manifold and downpipe, MSD DIS-4, and a few other things, and the car never ever went faster than 15.7.

It was pretty disappointing for the money I invested. I'd never do an ATX sports car ever again.

and this is why the ATX gets such a bad rap on this platform. i love it when people take what happens with ONE SPECIFIC CAR and generalize it to every car, ever made. yes, 3s n/a atx is SLOW. that's a specific setup on one specific model of car. you cannot extrapolate the performance of a mclaren SLR from that.

if you are disappointed with the results, you should have saved the extensive trial & error with different setups & gone straight for a tt conversion. it's already a well-documented fact that n/a mods for the 3/s are nigh worthless (save nitrous). there's INFINITELY more bang for the buck with swapping in stock vr4 forced induction parts. if you're pissed about a cost/benefit; blame the fact that you thought the additional .5L would fix everything--rather than going for some 9b's or better. the fault is in how you went about it, NOT with the transmission you used.


Yeah I meant to quote you.

Dang thats slower then I thought it would be. Do you think ATX and MTX are about the same from a roll? I think it might be the first gear that messes up the ATX its too damn long.

If my trans goes you think it wold be cheaper to do a 5 speed swap or rebuild (around $2000).

if you prefer a mtx; then do a swap. if you prefer an atx; rebuild it. if you're indifferent; go with whatever is cheaper.

of course....in this case, the FWD mtx is made of balsa-wood and glass. you really need an awd > fwd converted one. either way though, the atx trans's are cheaper. some by a WIDE margin. if you feel mechanically inclined, an ATX rebuild by yourself isn't that difficult. the internals are identical to those on DSM's, and there is a LOT of knowledge and support for it in that community (unlike the unwarranted negativism that it gets in the 3/s community). you can buy everything you need to make a VERY sturdy atx for less than 2k. less than 1k if you decide to keep the stock converter. all it really needs to "shine" is some upgraded clutch packs, upgraded end clutch, a shift kit, a trans cooler, and a secondary filter (magnetic).

i don't know what all was done to whitedragon's "built ipt transmission". i also don't know anything about how he launched it, what his converter stall is, or anything. regardless, hooked to an n/a 6g7x...it's going to be relatively slow; and yes, the mtx will be faster. but that gap between them (.5-1.0 seconds in stock form) all but disappears when you start talking about forced induction and a properly modded atx. there is a reason dsm atx's are running in the 8's regularly.

i'm not going to argue for or against your personal decision to keep or replace your atx. i do think you need to have all the FACTS before you do it--not biased, jaded anecdotes--which is what my blog entry is about. i'll also point out that until critical mass was reached for the 4th gear output shaft, the ATX in T4 was regularly trumping the MTX in the 1/4. take that for what it's worth. yes, it has an achilles heel. if you plan to have your car make > 800whp, then perhaps that's a legitimate gripe. but let's be honest. we can probably count the number of 3/s owners with >800whp without even taking our socks off.

p.s.
my fwd-tt (as it WAS but is no longer) with 9b's and 8psi ran dead even with a modded GTI turbo mtx in the 1/4. no wideband, no datalogger; no tt-ecu. and that was with an 8:1 engine. i could probably have busted mid 13's on a 10:1 and 13g's with some good engine monitoring.

my new setup will be 3.5L twin 16g setup running ~18psi. i expect low 11's-high 10's. and that's WITH the atx (awd).

[Ninja Performance]

While the ATX isn't bad for low hp setups, I would prefer the MTX.

-Chris

[95gto]

The mtx has lower drivetrain loss, and if you have two cars with the same power and comparable gearing but unequal losses, the car with lower losses will be faster. The only way to make the atx faster would be change the gearing which is a stupid move on a car that isn't drag strip dedicated. And a drag strip dedicated NA atx car is just stupid imo, its like picking a bmx bike for the Tour de France.

If you have the reasources to do an mtx 3.5L setup you will enjoy it more than an atx setup. Of the multiple 3.5L NA cars I have worked on and ridden in the mtx cars are faster. Faster than a 3.5L with a stock NA atx and faster than a 3.5L with a built 'race' transmission from these guys:
MITSUBISHI | EAGLE | DSM Performance Automatic Transmissions (http://www.importperformancetrans.com/mitsubishiauto.shtml)

And Inperctdarkness, if its lame to use a single car as an example why did you turn around and do it yourself????????

[jessecain1]

i havent ridden in any atx 3.5, but i can say if you do swap over to mtx you will not be disspointed coupled with the 3.5.

[whitedragon]

Yeah I meant to quote you.

Dang thats slower then I thought it would be do you remember what it trapped? Do you think ATX and MTX are about the same from a roll? I think it might be the first gear that messes up the ATX its too damn long.

If my trans goes you think it wold be cheaper to do a 5 speed swap or rebuild (around $2000).

If I remember, my traps were always between 89-93mph, regardless.


--not biased, jaded anecdotes--

Wow, who's jaded? And FYI, I had my car since '05, and xwire swapped the 3.5L in '06. We never set out to make a track monster, but through trial and error of the 3.5, and regular maintenance etc, I just had alot of different setups on my car. I never claimed to be creating a killer, it just happened that we went through alot of different things through the years.

For example, the 3.5L broke my trans, so xwire suggested I have IPT do the full rebuild on it with all the bells and whistles, so we did that. The 3.5 rubbed on the stock manifolds and downpipe, so xwire suggested headers that would have more clearance. After we did that and it sounded terrible and destroyed my lower end torque, he fabbed me up a different exhaust. He also suggested an MSD DIS-4 (which was pretty cool when it worked) and so on and so forth.

And this was all over the course of several years, and this was my DD, that I also took to the track at every opportunity because it was fun, and reliable.

I loved that car, so I think you have me mistaken with someone else when you imply that I'm "jaded" and that I was ignoring "well-documented" facts (of which, there weren't any about a 3.5 back then).

It just so happens that through the life of the car, I got to try alot of different things firsthand, and the simple fact is, the ATX just doesn't compare to the MTX, in speed and driveability.

And if you're going to talk Forced Induction, then why even bother TT'ing an NA, just buy a VR-4. That's what I did, and while I loved my SL, if I could go back in time and change it, I should have bought my RT/TT first. With less than half the money invested, it puts down twice the power, and handles better. So if you want to save your money, that's the real way to go.


The mtx has lower drivetrain loss, and if you have two cars with the same power and comparable gearing but unequal losses, the car with lower losses will be faster. The only way to make the atx faster would be change the gearing which is a stupid move on a car that isn't drag strip dedicated. And a drag strip dedicated NA atx car is just stupid imo, its like picking a bmx bike for the Tour de France.

If you have the reasources to do an mtx 3.5L setup you will enjoy it more than an atx setup. Of the multiple 3.5L NA cars I have worked on and ridden in the mtx cars are faster. Faster than a 3.5L with a stock NA atx and faster than a 3.5L with a built 'race' transmission from these guys:
MITSUBISHI | EAGLE | DSM Performance Automatic Transmissions (http://www.importperformancetrans.com/mitsubishiauto.shtml)


Agree 100% with 95gto, and also I'd like to point out that was the tranny rebuild I got from IPT. It cost almost $4000 when all was said and done to be fully built, heat treated, and with the Torque Converter.

[IPD]

i will agree with you about "buying a vr4 in the first place". if i had to do it over again; i'd do just that. and i'd immediately swap in an atx. much less headache that way, and i don't have a colossal fight with insurance coverage.

i don't feel that having IPT building you a trans is the best way to do things--at least not the most economical. that said, even if you're paying $4,000 for a complete trans, bear in mind the cost of a used 6-speed on ebay. now add in the cost of "building" that. you can chew through a wad of cash real quick with getrags; and since they're specific to JUST the 3/s--good luck with finding a wide assortment of suppliers. i can get aftermarket torque converters and clutch packs from a dozen or more suppliers for my trans.

i totally get what chris is saying when he says he prefers mtx. i get that. it's a matter of choice. he has personal preferences; just like everyone else. just because i'm not a huge fan of corvettes doesn't mean that they're shitty cars. just because i'm not a huge fan of rowing through gears doesn't mean that it doesn't have appeal for other people. what i am saying is that the "bashing" is uncalled for. there's pros and cons to any preferential choice a person makes. if you make a choice, great--i'm happy for you. and while we're at it, let's keep the BS to a minimum.

p.s.

95gto, i'm not basing my opinion off any one car. practically any AMG mercedes with a slushbox is a potent force to be reckoned with (the sl350 amg 7-speed was a tenth faster in the 1/4 than the 05 corvette mtx). many DSM's stick with them because they're known to handle higher HP levels better than the MTX--in that specific car. i drove an ls3 atx corvette today--and it wasn't a slouch by any stretch of imagination. of course, it also had the advantage of paddle shifters...but then again, i don't have anything against paddle-shifters; just rowing gears.

experience has taught me that most people who try "racing" an atx for the first time haven't a clue what power-braking is. it was an easy thing to demonstrate back when my car was FWD-tt. simply mashing on the gas would gradually start the car moving. power braking would spin the tires. pretty easy determination about what's getting more power to the wheels from a dead stop.

so again, don't let just the n/a atx experience of a 3/s make the determination for you that "atx's suck. period". the #1 reason why they have such a bad rap on this platform is because they were never offered with forced-induction stock--unlike the DSM's. a tt 3/s atx is NOTHING like an n/a 3/s atx. i know. i've driven my car extensively before and after. even 9b's 8:1 @ 8psi make it feel like the car is downshifting; even though it hasn't. running it in "PWR" mode (so that it downshifts faster) is a spectacular difference. putting your foot into it will instantaneously slam into 2nd gear and you take off.

[n2nsanity]

thanks for all the input guys
i'm really more of the see for myself type
so i'll keep all this in mind, but still going to try it out

good thing is, i'll probably get the opportunity to try both
starting with the atx, because that's the least amount of work
and i hate to waste this trans that has so much $ invested into it already

most likely i will just try it for a little while
when i have more time later on, i'll probably swap over to mtx, since they usually are more fun
i just really want to see for myself what this thing can do
if i'm happy i'll leave it this way for a while

if i'm disappointed, i'll be doing the mtx conversion sooner
either way, i already have every single thing i would need for the swap
there are a few things i'd want to upgrade tho
flywheel resurfaced and possibly shaved, new master and slave cylinders and braided ss lines instead of the used parts i have

but before i do anything, this rain needs to go away already
haven't been able to touch it for a week...

[95gto]

i will agree with you about "buying a vr4 in the first place". if i had to do it over again; i'd do just that. and i'd immediately swap in an atx. much less headache that way, and i don't have a colossal fight with insurance coverage.

i don't feel that having IPT building you a trans is the best way to do things--at least not the most economical. that said, even if you're paying $4,000 for a complete trans, bear in mind the cost of a used 6-speed on ebay. now add in the cost of "building" that. you can chew through a wad of cash real quick with getrags; and since they're specific to JUST the 3/s--good luck with finding a wide assortment of suppliers. i can get aftermarket torque converters and clutch packs from a dozen or more suppliers for my trans.

i totally get what chris is saying when he says he prefers mtx. i get that. it's a matter of choice. he has personal preferences; just like everyone else. just because i'm not a huge fan of corvettes doesn't mean that they're shitty cars. just because i'm not a huge fan of rowing through gears doesn't mean that it doesn't have appeal for other people. what i am saying is that the "bashing" is uncalled for. there's pros and cons to any preferential choice a person makes. if you make a choice, great--i'm happy for you. and while we're at it, let's keep the BS to a minimum.

p.s.

95gto, i'm not basing my opinion off any one car. practically any AMG mercedes with a slushbox is a potent force to be reckoned with (the sl350 amg 7-speed was a tenth faster in the 1/4 than the 05 corvette mtx). many DSM's stick with them because they're known to handle higher HP levels better than the MTX--in that specific car. i drove an ls3 atx corvette today--and it wasn't a slouch by any stretch of imagination. of course, it also had the advantage of paddle shifters...but then again, i don't have anything against paddle-shifters; just rowing gears.

experience has taught me that most people who try "racing" an atx for the first time haven't a clue what power-braking is. it was an easy thing to demonstrate back when my car was FWD-tt. simply mashing on the gas would gradually start the car moving. power braking would spin the tires. pretty easy determination about what's getting more power to the wheels from a dead stop.

so again, don't let just the n/a atx experience of a 3/s make the determination for you that "atx's suck. period". the #1 reason why they have such a bad rap on this platform is because they were never offered with forced-induction stock--unlike the DSM's. a tt 3/s atx is NOTHING like an n/a 3/s atx. i know. i've driven my car extensively before and after. even 9b's 8:1 @ 8psi make it feel like the car is downshifting; even though it hasn't. running it in "PWR" mode (so that it downshifts faster) is a spectacular difference. putting your foot into it will instantaneously slam into 2nd gear and you take off.

Dude, sit down the hatorade and take a breath. No one bashed an atx or said they suck period, people with direct experience with them laid out the basics they determined from personal experiences. No one told the guy "don't do it" they said he would be happier with an mtx.

The op is planning on getting his atx up and running, and given how far he is with his install I would say it makes sense to at least try it. He is planning on coming to the NG so we can see how his car does.

I also believe you are NG bound this year right? Solid performance by your car on the drag strip will be the best supporting arguement you could make for an atx on this platform. So bring your car and show people what you are talking about, it is quite literally that simple.

My advice to the op though is to hang onto the mtx setup.

[n2nsanity]

i'm definitely keeping all the mtx conversion parts
i wasn't even considering going the atx route until i ran into this car
i just want to try it out since it's already there
the $ was already spent and the work was already done, so why not

[Boomer3000]

My 2 cents... Potatoes... It worked for me.

[95gto]

i'm definitely keeping all the mtx conversion parts
i wasn't even considering going the atx route until i ran into this car
i just want to try it out since it's already there
the $ was already spent and the work was already done, so why not

I would agree 100%, given how far you are now I would agree you might as well try it.

[RL7]

At least you can drink TWO beers while driving with the ATX. That's probably why I still have mine.

[IPD]

At least you can drink TWO beers while driving with the ATX. That's probably why I still have mine.

-diddle the gf/wife
-change stations on the radio
-eat lunch

any or all of the above. :) i can also drive with my left foot out the window. :D

[Boomer3000]

or eat a potato

[TUFFTR]

Ive mastered eating maccas while driving a manual. I have pretty much reached the pinnacle of driving. :D

[GTwizard]

Looking for NA's to play with at NG11.
3.0s, 3.5, ATX,adn MTX.
Like to see someone other than 3SX compete with ours. Their alcohal burning, 13 to 1 compression is a monster for sure.
I am sure they too would like someone other than I to play with. LOL. I am still 3.0 adn still 10 to 1. Someone need to do 100 in the 1/4, adn low 14s.
Is this NG11 smack/Hype? You bet it is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0JsdftRv0k
1ST place NA dyno - TX gathering 2010 - 229 FWHP
1st place Fastest NA - TXG 2010 - 98.3 trap
1st Place quickest NA - TXG 2010 - 14.680
2ND place 1/4 at NG10
best NA time NG10 - 14.932- no traction
2ND place 1/4 at NG09
2ND place Autocross NG09

[GTwizard]

Ive mastered eating maccas while driving a manual. I have pretty much reached the pinnacle of driving. :D

Dude,
What the hell is Maccas? Is that a friend of yours? Post pics. ;)

[IPD]

i would have had trouble trapping over 100 when i was fwd tt. but that was with 2.3 second 60'. doing it n/a is an accomplishment!

i can't spin the tires right now if i try...so i'm sure i'd be a bit faster than 2 years ago. ;)

[TUFFTR]

Dude,
What the hell is Maccas? Is that a friend of yours? Post pics. ;)

maccas? McDonalds? we just say maccas...:P
I trapped 106MPH but ran a 15.08 :( would like to get the speed down if i can cross the line a bit quicker!

[n2nsanity]

weather finally cleared up. i started prepping for pulling the atx back out. trans motor mount, starter and all electrical stuff out of the way, all bolts loosened. jack and block of wood supporting the trans. just have to pull the axle and remove the bolts and hopefully i can drop it out the bottom easily.

also did some cleanup and removing interior. i'm swapping all the tan for charcoal.

also started pulling the dash to try to get this battery relocation finished. the way i want it to go through the firewall, it will be much easier with the dash out.

anyway, after doing all this i started finding and getting irritated with all the hacked up wires
also, the shifter is all loose and needs to be repaired
and then started thinking if the dash is already going to be out, removing the wire harness will be a lot easier, which is making me lean more towards going back to my original plan (mtx conversion).
also, all the splash guards are already off
the front bumper already needs taken off for repair

so once the trans is out, i'm about 30% of the way done with the mtx conversion anyway

we'll see, i really want to see what the atx with a shift kit, upgraded tq converter and lsd can do, but at the same time i'm really tempted to ditch that idea the more i see all these random disconnected and hacked up wires


battery relocation:
http://i52.tinypic.com/2ylnztc.jpg

http://i52.tinypic.com/16jn2oo.jpg


hacked up wires:
http://i51.tinypic.com/qnoi13.jpg

[IPD]

just do the MTX conversion already. you'll probably be doubly pissed if you aren't satisfied with the atx--as i suspect you wouldn't be anyways.

[GTwizard]

We were ATX at one time. Did the 3400 high stall and blue bands and red clutches. It was OK, and was quick, (for ATX) but nothing like converting to MTX. Just hold a "full of fluid" torque converter in your hands, Than pick up a light weight flywheel and clutch assembly. The differance in the rotational weight will blow you away. And the weight diff between atx and MTX is going to a bunch different as well. You don't need all the extra bagage. Dump the ATX. You will be happier. The ATX was fun in a strait line. But when that yellow sign on the side of the road is warning you of sharp curves and winding roads, you will soon learn that driving a manual is Balls more fun. As that sign simply means down shift and hammer.

[SOHC]

We were ATX at one time. Did the 3400 high stall and blue bands and red clutches. It was OK, and was quick, (for ATX) but nothing like converting to MTX. Just hold a "full of fluid" torque converter in your hands, Than pick up a light weight flywheel and clutch assembly. The differance in the rotational weight will blow you away. And the weight diff between atx and MTX is going to a bunch different as well. You don't need all the extra bagage. Dump the ATX. You will be happier. The ATX was fun in a strait line. But when that yellow sign on the side of the road is warning you of sharp curves and winding roads, you will soon learn that driving a manual is Balls more fun. As that sign simply means down shift and hammer.

Did you have the heads/cams, etc. when you were ATX?

[TUFFTR]

*flaps arms around calling you chicken* come onnnnnnnnnnn convert it!

[IPD]

*flaps arms around calling you chicken* come onnnnnnnnnnn convert it!

hell, i'm the biggest proponent of atx's in the community....and even i think he should just get it over with.

[SOHC]

hell, i'm the biggest proponent of atx's in the community....and even i think he should just get it over with.

You just want to buy his atx thats why. :lol:

[GTwizard]

Did you have the heads/cams, etc. when you were ATX?

Had the head work, headers, and fresh .020 over slugs with the ATX. That was about it. ALL the other goodies came after 5speed install. The newest of cams, Adjustable cam gears, and intake was done 1 week before NG last. Than the Dyno at TX gathering.
Hope to get an other trans shortly and tune for NG11. I can say we did have traction issues. When side stepping the brake at 3400 and than the induction bodies would open at 3500 keeping the tires guessing for traction. Those days are gone. Now the quest is how to maintain traction in 3 gears, not just the first 1. LOL. The manual also give you a better feel or keeps your sesnses more in touch with the motor abilities. Matching gear shifts with different point along the power band, upshifting and down shifting alows you to use more of the motor when you need it most. The ATX hides or masks this feed back that you get from the drive line. Thought you might like to know.

[n2nsanity]

well, i should be at the deciding point tomorrow. Once everything's out, it'll just be a matter of what's going back in

if i end up going the mtx route, i'd sell the atx, tq converter and everything that goes with it for like $500

[IPD]

You just want to buy his atx thats why. :lol:

either you're new, or you've overlooked the fact that i wouldn't be able to use his transmission anyways. not without doing a lot of cannibalizing. and at that point, if i'm going to the trouble of pulling the trans; i'lll probably build it MY way with new parts.

[n2nsanity]

well, dash is out, it's not as helpful as i'd hoped
think i need to take the hvac assembly out too.
while it's out it'd be nice to go ahead and replace the heater, evap cores and blend doors, but i doubt time/funds will allow for that

http://i54.tinypic.com/1zxplph.jpg
i outsmarted the wind with some vice grips :p

[GTwizard]

I am now 63.
Not my age. My registration number for NG11.
Running all events.

[Alex3000gt]

Going from ATX to MTX, no other mods, I gained 1 sec and 4 MPH in the 1/4 mile.

ATXs are nice for turbo'd 3/Ss, less wheel spin with the longer gears but awful for NAs.

[Alex3000gt]

I am now 63.
Not my age. My registration number for NG11.
Running all events.

Same.

[n2nsanity]

well, of course i ended up changing plans again, so now back to my original project....
i'm sticking to this one, unless i run across a steal on a spyder, lol

maybe i'll try reinstalling this atx on the other car
reverse wasn't working on that one anyway
i just have no luck with these things
i still think the problem was likely electrical
if you saw the condition of the current wire harness, you'd probably think so too


anyway, i started pulling some atx stuff
old shifter and brake pedal assemblies are out

making a template using the clutch/brake pedal assembly and see if i can find anything that can put holes in the firewall

[BigTyla]

If you aren't going FI just switch to MTX. Take it from someone who's had an ATX with an n/a and a TT.

And of course as I make this post I see that you are indeed going MTX.

[Chris@Rvengeperformance]

well, of course i ended up changing plans again, so now back to my original project....
i'm sticking to this one, unless i run across a steal on a spyder, lol

maybe i'll try reinstalling this atx on the other car
reverse wasn't working on that one anyway
i just have no luck with these things
i still think the problem was likely electrical
if you saw the condition of the current wire harness, you'd probably think so too


anyway, i started pulling some atx stuff
old shifter and brake pedal assemblies are out

making a template using the clutch/brake pedal assembly and see if i can find anything that can put holes in the firewall

Iirc I used a 1" 1/8 hole saw on a compact 1/4 drive drill for the slave cylinder hole.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[IPD]

If you aren't going FI just switch to MTX. Take it from someone who's had an ATX with an n/a and a TT.

And of course as I make this post I see that you are indeed going MTX.

i 100% agree. of course, even an n/a MTX is just piss slow compared to most new cars these days. i'm of the opinion that FI is how a 3/s should be--even just fwd.

[n2nsanity]

already well along on the mtx conversion
i'm considering tt conversion later
just taking it one step at a time for now

shifter is out
http://i53.tinypic.com/15e8rpv.jpg

cleaned up one of my old mtx radiators
tirefoam works wonders
http://i54.tinypic.com/25st013.jpg

old ecu and tcu are out

[n2nsanity]

drilled out the holes for the clutch cylinder
hole saw didnt work at all, just scored the surface
but the stepless drill bits cut through like butter, although it's not as clean as i wanted it to look
i took all kinds of stuff off to get the pedal assembly in there

http://i56.tinypic.com/zog86g.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/21k02fs.jpg


stepless drill bits
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-piece-stepless-drill-bits-66463.html
were on sale for $5 in store, i'm very impressed with these

[GTwizard]

Keep the ATX Radiator. Don't change That out. That ATX rad is the same size as a VR4 rad. Trust me.

[IPD]

Keep the ATX Radiator. Don't change That out. That ATX rad is the same size as a VR4 rad. Trust me.

this.

[TUFFTR]

Great work mate!

[BigTyla]

this.

this x2. I'd plug the passages for the ATX oil just so crap doesn't get in there in case you change your mind. :p

[Chris@Rvengeperformance]

wow your hole saw must have sucked balls or you gave up too soon. Made a nice clean hole in mine.

[BigTyla]

stepless drill bits
3 Piece Stepless Drill Bits (http://www.harborfreight.com/3-piece-stepless-drill-bits-66463.html)
were on sale for $5 in store, i'm very impressed with these

Harbor Frieght is AMAZING. So glad we have one where I live now. I don't know how I lived without it!

[n2nsanity]

wow your hole saw must have sucked balls or you gave up too soon. Made a nice clean hole in mine.

both lol
it was just scoring the surface so i gave up
and i didn't feel like paying $40 for the bimetal set just for it to possibly do the same thing

http://i55.tinypic.com/2ymdk6o.jpg

[Chris@Rvengeperformance]

yeah you gotta have a metal setup to cut sheetmetal.

[n2nsanity]

clutch/brake pedal assembly is installed
clutch cylinder is installed
5spd shifter assembly installed

in the middle of pulling the old wire harness

as i was pulling wires, i realized just how many conversions i'm doing all at once, lol
after swapping wire harnesses i'm just adding to the confusion
i really want to do this because of the condition of the old one
this thing was hacked all to pieces

anyway here's everything i'm doing:

3.0 to 3.5
atx to mtx
ca to fed spec
ecs delete
and probably abs delete

http://i51.tinypic.com/20jk3k1.jpg

http://i56.tinypic.com/llc1h.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/2rrnw41.jpg

[n2nsanity]

so, i got the old wire harness out today and the new one is in for the most part
still have to connect a lot of it and zip tie everything down

i will say, this is not for the faint of heart
much easier if the whole front end is off, but still tedious even then
i probably spent 6 hours on this so far

definitely have to remove the splash guards and a few other things that the harness tucks through
dash off gives some room, but i think adds more loose connections than it actually helps
lower dash and brackets off helped quite a bit
i had the radiator, condenser and drier out which also helped a lot
abs was all kinds of in the way
ac and ps cooler lines were in the way a little
those were the bigger obstacles, but there were several other smaller ones

good trick here, i was putting the new one in as i was pulling the old one out to make it easier to route/connect everything properly and not forget what went where

anyway, all that's left is to put the actual mtx, new clutch kit, resurfaced flywheel and dash back in
a few other minor details and i should be ready to rock
hopefully everything still works when i get it back together lol

hard stuff is definitely out of the way at least :)

also, ac is gonna be nice and cold
new compressor, drier, orings and a good flush before it's all back together

looks like its puking wires
http://i51.tinypic.com/2yzfpf7.jpg

[Ninja Performance]

Looks like it threw up LOL

-Chris

[n2nsanity]

old trans is out
dropped it out the bottom, don't think i'll do that again, that atx is big and heavy
pulling the mtx out of my old parts car was easy, just dropped right out
it probably would have actually taken me less time to pull the whole eng/trans out together, then take it off
also, one of the trans to block bolts (one closest to rear motor mount) wouldn't fit past the motor mount bracket
i may shave the edge of the bracket to fix this

atx and flex plate off
http://i52.tinypic.com/bezzfd.jpg

also, i apparently have a ps leak

[BigTyla]

dropped it out the bottom, don't think i'll do that again, that atx is big and heavy

Yeah kinda. :p

[IPD]

Yeah kinda. :p

if fat chicks bothered me that much...i wouldn't be driving a 3/s in the first place. ;)

[n2nsanity]

weather hasn't been cooperating last couple of days, so still got a ways to go
also, i had an old flywheel resurfaced, but i think i want to wait and go with a new one instead

before i put the mtx in, i want to do figure out the abs and ecs delete
wondering if i should try to replace the spindles/hubs or not
also, not sure what to do about the brake lines
it'd be a good time to remove/replace all this stuff
not a whole lot of room to work on the proportioning valve and lines with the engine and trans in
i could pull it all from the other car, but i'm not sure if i want to make that one non-drivable or not
a few people are interested in it

any tips for the abs/ecs delete would be appreciated

[GTwizard]

I have parts cars, so pulling the lines and propors valve was easy swap. Ah, that was when the motor ws out. I did it because all the ABS brake lines where frozen and rusted through. There is the ABC control located behind the passengers side plastic rear panel nect to the back seat. Go to 316 stealth for the wire jumpoer diagram so as not to through the ABS light. ECS, Dunno.

[n2nsanity]

thx, i knew about the abs computer already
also, have the body harness too in case i need it
probably so, it's more hacked up than the engine harness
i didn't really think about the abs or ecs delete until i was about halfway done with the engine harness swap
one thing i thought was odd is on every 3/s i've had, they all have this connector that's a perfect fit for ecs by the brake booster, but it's only on the drivers side, not one on the other side

[n2nsanity]

new flywheel and clutch kit installed
working on cleaning up the old mtx now
also thinking about replacing the axle seals
ive never seen one leak, but i'd like to replace them
are they a real pain to replace?

http://i51.tinypic.com/35mi81f.jpg

http://i52.tinypic.com/rkx1d4.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/14311rt.jpg
that bolt closest to the firewall is still there for a reason... rear motor mount bracket in the way :(

[TUFFTR]

Nah mate, drill a self tapper into them and pull them out with the claw bit on a hammer, goop up the outside of the new seal, apply a bit of trans oil to the inner ring, and hit it in with an appropriate size socket, you'll know its 100% in when she bottoms out on the casing.

replace em now mate or you'll kick yourself!
also change the slave cyl and make sure you lube up the input shaft aswell :D

[n2nsanity]

i'm getting anxious, i may end up saving them for later.
still have plenty of work left in that area anyway, unless i end up doing all of that now too
lowering springs, rebuilt calipers, slotted rotors, replace the broken lug stud....

transmission is mounted
wasn't terrible, but i'm glad i had some help with it
much lighter and smaller than the atx, but still pretty heavy

also, shaved down part of the rear motor mount bracket. this helped quite a bit i think
wish i would've done it before it was in the car, would've saved me a lof of time and been more accurate
anyway, problem solved :) althought not as clean as i wanted
http://i56.tinypic.com/91e4wg.jpg
without doing this, i couldn't remove the old bolt and probably would've made it hard to get the mtx installed without removing the whole rear mount and bracket

installed the mtx through the bottom
axle in first because the ps axle is tough to get in
http://i56.tinypic.com/2wq8n7r.jpg

mtx installed
http://i52.tinypic.com/2wny1d1.jpg

[TUFFTR]

6 puck eh....what made you go with a 6puck over a full face?

[n2nsanity]

it's somewhere in between a 4 puck and a full
seemed like the best option at the time
hoping to improve friction but not have to replace it after 6 months lol

[n2nsanity]

didn't have much time today. most of that was spent cleaning up and repainting the trans mount bracket
i didn't notice this before but the atx and mtx mount brackets are way different. really glad i kept the one from the parts car
but the old bracket was pretty nasty and rusty so i sanded it down and repainted

also realized that 91,92s used a cable for the speedometer and 93+ use a sensor...
i have a 92 mtx in a 94, and on top of that both ends are female, so i'm going to have to improvise something

speedo cable vs sensor
http://i56.tinypic.com/21llheg.jpg

or i could do nothing and keep it under 100k miles for a while longer :)

well, i got the motor mount and starter in at least

[TUFFTR]

Very strange mate, when doing auto> manual I actually have a picture of both mounts and mine were identical!

[GTwizard]

Pucks SUCK. Straite up. Changed a ton of them out. And countless number of discs that have spit out the springs from the hubs.
Should have gone full face and spring free (solid) hub. The spec 5 hubs need to bolted between each rivet with a grade 8 bolt to help hold the hub from shearing the rivets under crazy hard use.
Sorry, no pics of the bolted hub.

[n2nsanity]

mounts were way different, i'll get pics later
i'm glad i've been hoarding parts, lol

i'll look into the full face solid hub setup for next time
either that or a twin disc setup
but, hopefully that won't be anytime soon
i'd like to enjoy driving this thing for a while first
i started this project in september
8 months later, still not quite done....

[n2nsanity]

no need to improvise on the speedo
pulled apart the old atx sensor and found this :)

http://i52.tinypic.com/5vvzo4.jpg

[n2nsanity]

solid shifter bushings installed
http://i56.tinypic.com/14kkvgy.jpg

brand new mtx starter installed
http://i56.tinypic.com/fcsbhf.jpg

wish i had more time to clean everything up
this thing was nasty, but the bulk of the gunk is off at least
hopefully next time i do this i'll be dropping in a brand new getrag :)

[TUFFTR]

So does the electric sensor in the gearbox plug right into the 92< model gearboxes? In the magnas, all years had a cable driven speedo and I'd love to get rid of the cable to clean up the engine bay, but Im guessing it's not possible as then the speedo head would be different aswell?

[n2nsanity]

not that simple, lol

the cable goes straight from the trans into the back of the speedo
i think you'd have to change out the speedo and whole engine wire harness
probably also the dash harness

[n2nsanity]

well, i changed the mtx fluid, 2qts should be enough, it's on jack stands and on a hill, so nowhere near level to check it accurately

dash is back in, kindof, only 2 bolts holding it in case i need to pull it back out

Everything important should be connected for the most part
except for the smaller connector in the dash on the pass side behind the vent, can't find the wire that goes there

and this looks important, drivers side near fuseblock, not sure where it goes
http://i56.tinypic.com/2uyoh81.jpg
*Edit, found it, the missing end was stuck in between the fender and the body

i thought the clutch safety switch was part of the engine harness, i was wrong....
here's the connector
http://i55.tinypic.com/2j0y1kk.jpg

here's where it would plug into on the mtx dash harness, which i didnt install yet, and hopefully don't have to
http://i55.tinypic.com/30w7e5s.jpg

[n2nsanity]

test fitted the ebay downpipe today
was pretty tough to get on, don't think the holes were aligned properly
when i take it off again, i'll just widen them a hair
i need to get the o2 bung in anyway
also, it's about 1/2 inch shorter, but i was able to pull the cat forward to get those bolts in, so no big deal

good thing is, plenty of clearance from the oilpan compared to the stock downpipe
http://i51.tinypic.com/2pyaj68.jpg

[n2nsanity]

Tried a bunch of things today, still no start :(

First, I found that missing connector, it was stuck behind the fuseblock, in this hollow part of the body
After connecting it and reconnecting the battery, now i hear what sounds like the fuelpump turning on when i try to start, but still nothing from the starter
also, not hearing the click from the mfi relay

Tried the original battery cables, since my current setup is in the trunk and thought maybe bad ground, same results though
battery guage reads 13v and barely fluctuates when i turn the key
seems like it's supposed to drop considerably, even without the starter spinning

I have quite a few ideas to try still, but running out quickly

My remaining suspects:

1st, This is the far end passenger side of the dash, from bottom, behind the ac vent
Can't find the the matching connector anywhere
http://i52.tinypic.com/35kr32w.jpg

2nd, does this controller need to be mounted for a good ground? could this be the cause?
http://i56.tinypic.com/zydmqh.jpg

3rd, 2 more unidentified connectors, passenger side floorboard where the harness comes in behind fender
http://i54.tinypic.com/15my738.jpg


other than that, the only other things unplugged are stuff in the dash like ac controls and other dash switches

or maybe somethings not grounded properly, like one of the sensors or relays
there's an mfi relay on pass side of console, its screwed in, but not very tight
there's another relay on drivers side of console, its screwed in, but maybe not tight enough

[TUFFTR]

I would probably bypass it all and wire in your own starter relay. At least then you'll know she'll start.

[n2nsanity]

i've thought about that, maybe the starter relay should be on my list of things to check
right now my $ is on that missing connector on the passenger side up in the dash
i'd suspect the starter relay, but i'm not hearing the normal click from the mfi relay
so i think it's most likely something not plugged in or possibly something wrong with the wire harness although it appears to be in good shape
i'll think twice before i mess with wire harnesses again, lol

[BigTyla]

Wiring can definitely be a pain in the ass. You might have a pinched wire somewhere that will be hard to find. I hope that's not the case as tracing wires is the most painful job imaginable for any auto work.

[Alex3000gt]

Wiring can definitely be a pain in the ass. You might have a pinched wire somewhere that will be hard to find. I hope that's not the case as tracing wires is the most painful job imaginable for any auto work.

As I recall didn't you saw through a harness a while back?

[BigTyla]

As I recall didn't you saw through a harness a while back?

Nope, I bought a harness adapter and hacked into it. :D

[n2nsanity]

i found the missing connector on the passenger side under the dash, so that's connected now
i believe everything is hooked up correctly
everything i thought to be a major concern has been resolved

now when i turn the key to start, i hear the fuelpump making all kinds of noise, but nothing from the starter
changed out the starter relay, no change
grounded the etacs, no change

i'm going to try to hotwire the starter or push start it tomorrow
if i push start going really slow, i don't think it will do much harm
that's the only thing i can think of to help figure out what the problem is and see if everything else is working properly

any advice/tips would be greatly appreciated

aside from working on the no start issues, i flushed the ac lines
everything's hooked up and with a new compressor, new drier and all new orings
radiator and condensor back in, although i think i need to swap fans
apparently i put my old 92 radiator in, but one of the connectors for the fans are different, 6 pins instead of 4 pins
no big, deal, i can just switch that one fan out

[Alex3000gt]

Is all wiring going to the starter hooked up? Verify and then trace the harness back and double check.

[n2nsanity]

it's hooked up correctly, that's probably the easiest thing i've done yet

[n2nsanity]

It's ALIVE!!

Roll started it down the driveway
As long as I park on a hill with nothing in the way, should be set, lol

Took it for a drive around the neighborhood, everything felt and sounded pretty solid, but i think it is running a little lean (no o2 sensor at the moment)

Now that I know everything works for the most part, I can start wrapping everything up and get this thing back together.

Left to do:

- Either figure out the no start problem, or maybe install a push button start :)
YouTube - &#x202a;shooter83&#39;s Channel&#x202c;&rlm; (http://www.youtube.com/user/shooter83#p/u/1/rTv8zf4EhjE)

- o2 bung in the new downpipe and wire in the sensor

- Finish up the battery relocation, brackets for the battery and install the new power and ground distribution blocks

- If time and $ allows, replace both axles

- Get dash back together

- Finish Interior swap

- Then a bunch of cosmetic and sound work, and should be all set :)

[TUFFTR]

fantastic!
just keep an eye on fluid levels and you'll be sweet! Put about 15K on my 3.5L so far and loved every minute of it! the beauty of an N/A engine.
Many congratulations, have the little loose ends tied up and start enjoying her!

[n2nsanity]

chris from ninjaperformance is the man! :)
thank you, i found my last wire, that's a tiny little fucker too to be causing so much trouble
car starts now, but the starter is actually bad, even though its brand new
which i was already assuming because it wouldn't engage when hot wiring it either
at least now the key makes it spin and do nothing instead of just doing nothing at all, lol
i think they gave me an auto starter and it's spinning, but not fully reaching the teeth
i'll be extremely pissed if it damaged my brand new flywheel

anyway this wire wasn't seated properly, and i was thinking it was just a ground lol
this is all that was preventing the starter from spinning, although my new starter is either bad or they gave me an atx starter which engages a little bit shorter
http://i51.tinypic.com/rr74hj.jpg

So i guess next on my list is to replace the starter

Then find a place to mount my new coolant overflow tank and hope it works proplery
http://i55.tinypic.com/2dt4uiw.jpg
ignore my temporary ground lol, it's just temporary and i'm still working on a custom ground wire kit
and even more so, disregard the balled up shirt, it's insulating my temporary power distribution block, which is actually a battery terminal, lol
i have a new one, but haven't installed it yet. these other issues been keeping me busy

Then i need to fix my power windows, they randomly stopped working yesterday

I should also test my speedo, rpm and fuel guage while i'm thinking of it

[n2nsanity]

aghh, speedo fuel and everything else not working
only thing on the speedo working is the flashing ecs sport light
now also my temp and battery guage not working
wtf, for everything i fix, at least 1 other thing breaks :(

[TUFFTR]

mate I say this now, Do not crank the car with the auto starter in there. My car started maybe 20 times before it chewed up the end of the ring gear. It catches the flywheel by about 1mm...that's all

So do yourself a favor, dont crank it anymore until you get that MTX starter! the throw out is ALOT more.

[n2nsanity]

not sure if it's an atx starter or not, but it's definitely not catching enough to turn anything at all
think i've only tried it 2 times, once jumping the solenoid and once with the key
so if there is any damage, hopefully it's minimal
when i have time later i'll spin it over slowly by hand and inspect the teeth through the starter hole

[Alex3000gt]

Where did the flywheel come from? JDM NA flywheels are 1cm smaller in diameter than the USDM flywheels. I found this out the hard way when I installed a JDM engine in my fiancee's car. Had to drop the trans, again, and put a USDM flywheel on.


Told you to inspect the starter wiring harness! Glad you solved that issue.

[n2nsanity]

yeah, thanks man, you were right first, everything looked good to me at the time tho
then chris told me to look for that specific connector. guess i messed up with all that tugging on everything
i'd prefer not touch any wires again anytime soon, lol

flywheel is from advance auto and for a 3000, so i'd assume it's right
actually, got both the starter and flywheel new from them, so if one or both are bad or damaged, i should be covered
i'll get starter tested tomorrow hopefully

now, to figure out this o2 sensor wiring :(
having trouble locating the connector that would normally go near the shifter through the floor to the downpipe
only one i see so far is the one on the alternator harness, but don't think i can use that
i'll hopefully figure it out while doing the interior swap

while i'm at it, anyone have advice on a wideband o2?
also, for different placement? not a single hole anywhere on my current exhaust, so i can put it anywhere i want
also, would mil eliminators be an option worth considering?

[n2nsanity]

starter tested out good. now what? :confused2:
tried click click start, although i don't think that even applies to my case
starter spins fine and without hesitation, just doesn't throw out far enough to turn the flywheel. looking at the teeth of the starter, it looks like it's barely touching the flywheel at all, which would leave me to believe it's the wrong specs or defective. wish i had a known good 5spd starter to test on it. it could even be that my flywheel is not right specs, which would be much more of a pita. would like to figure it out soon before my new axles come in. any help would be appreciated

[Alex3000gt]

Sounds like the flywheel is too small. I had this same issue.

Just to verify, try another 5speed starter.

You aren't installing it upside down are you?

[n2nsanity]

upside down :confused2:

[Alex3000gt]

Are the teeth on the starter facing the teeth on the flywheel?


Please verify that you have a MTX starter and not an ATX starter. Please verify you have an NA flywheel and not a TT flywheel.

If the starter is not engaging but checked out good then there is a mismatch here.

The FWD flywheel is LARGER than the AWD flywheel.

[n2nsanity]

i'm sure the starter is in right. it would fit backwards with teeth facing away from flywheel?
also, ran 8 guage wire straight to the solenoid, still same results
tried a whole seperate battery on the starter, connected with jumper cables, still no change
i think best option is to find a known working starter to test

i set the new flywheel on top of the old one. they looked the same to me
didn't measure them with a micrometer or anything tho

on a side note, i found the o2 wires, tucked under the carpet and further from the shifter than i expected. also, not the connector i was expecting
debating getting a new one, but don't think i need to

[Alex3000gt]

If the flywheels are truly identical, then sounds like you have an automatic starter. The manual trans starters have a longer nose.

[n2nsanity]

i have a couple of extra atx starters, that's all i had to compare it to
they looked identical to me as far as overall shape and size and length of nose
checked the throwout and that looked the same too
the teeth looked like they might be slightly different, but hard to tell

also, on the new starter you can see where the very edge of the starter teeth where it was rubbing a little
so i'm pretty sure something's not right with the starter and it's not something i did wrong
trying to borrow one from someone local to test and be sure
i'm quickly running out of time

[Alex3000gt]

Then you have an ATX starter.

You require a MTX starter. March down to your local auto parts store and buy a MTX starter.

[n2nsanity]

finally my car starts with the key! no more push starts :)
i went back to the autostore, this time persistent that they pull every starter they had in stock for comparison
i was thinking something was up because the new one i got looked just like the 2 atx starters i have
somehow the one i bought ended up getting stamped and boxed up on the assembly line as an mtx starter, but it was actually an atx starter
anyway, they gladly exchanged it after seeing the difference
i can't believe the last guy had the nerve to say, "u sure u don't have your flywheel on backwards"
don't think that's even possible, lol

after getting the new one, i took some measurements
the mtx starter is about 8mm longer, which is almost how thick the flywheel teeth are (10mm i think)

comparison of mtx/atx starters
http://i51.tinypic.com/16kqdn7.jpg

got new bolts too, the old ones i had were getting stripped out
found some m10 - 1.25 x 50mm on the shelf and were only like $2 for the set
these worked pretty good, but i wouldn't go any shorter than 50mm, oem length is 60mm i think

[n2nsanity]

now on to the more frustrating issues....

the most important thing i know i need to do is get an o2 sensor installed
if time and $ permits, i'll get a new one, only like $50 or so, but need to be ordered
and still need to get the bung welded into the downpipe

if i can sell my previous "would be project car" this weekend, that should speed up things a bit

still waiting on new axles to come in
mine feel ok so far, but the boots are in horrible shape, and i don't trust them, especially not for a 1500 mile trip
and it's about the same price to get whole new axles as getting all new boots, so i'm going that route

my biggest concern is i feel like i'm running way too hot
could running with no o2 make it run hotter than normal?
i'm sure being 100 outside doesn't help either
a working temp guage will help tho
engine and head fuses were blown, replaced those and now temp and battery guages are working again, so i'll give her another run tonight
also, my windows don't work any more, but locks still work fine, no idea what happened there
but for now, i'm using a cordless drill battery to operate my windows, lol

really wish i had someone local to assist with the remaining pesky issues

[BigTyla]

Running no O2 might cause you to run lean. That would create hotter exhaust gases than normal.

[GTwizard]

Starter bolt have a sholder for a better allignment. You risk ware and tare using those. Next, the threads of any and all bolts MUST engage 1.5 xs their diameter or will not toque to spec and hold with out damage to the threads. Starter bolts engage about 2 xs their diam do to the stress levels created from the starter torque. So if your bolts are 50 rather than 60. You are not done and need to go back and do it again before you have other issues with starter and ring gear. Concider you already stated the bolt threads were not looking good, say you should have gone longer, not shorter. Going shorter was a really bad idea. Though you and others should know.

[n2nsanity]

i'll go longer as soon as i can find some, 50mm was the longest available at the time
the threads of the original bolts were in bad shape, that's why i went with new although slightly shorter ones
this is just temporary. I'll probably order some through the dealership next week, only like $4 or so for the set

took her for another short ride tonight. feels great :)
can't wait to see how she does with the o2 sensor installed

replaced 2 blown fuses and now my temp and batt guages are working again
still seems hotter than normal to me, but temp guage didn't even reach the halfway mark
last test drive, it was like 100 out and coolant wasn't topped off, so hard to tell if there's a problem just yet

[n2nsanity]

was doing interior swaps at midnight lol
got the big stuff done at least, carpet, seats, headliners

http://i53.tinypic.com/2mf0oqx.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/oqzjg9.jpg

this would've been nearly impossible, but i figured out how to hotwire the power seats
the red car had the charcoal power leather seats, but it's a base model and didn't have the wiring for it
have no idea how the guy even got the seats installed unless he did what i did
hotwiring the motor from the connector at the front of the seat

after figuring this out, it took about 2 hours to swap interiors
red car is about 90% done, green car is only about 50% because i still may need to do some rewiring and other things
once the o2 sensor is installed and if i can get all the guages working, i'll finish the interior
but until then, i don't want to finalize anything

[n2nsanity]

also, swapped the exterior door/window trim
was going to buy new, but it's like $200 for the set, so trading for the better set off the red car was the most feasible option

one more issue i havent hear anyone else mention in their mtx conversion
what can i do about this? (can't start or remove key if it's not in the correct position)
http://i53.tinypic.com/kdn13b.jpg


also, while i'm thinking of it...
what is this box mounted on the floor under drivers seat?
http://i53.tinypic.com/dlsrc9.jpg

[Alex3000gt]

Pull that cord to make your ignition able to turn and forget about it. At least thats what I did.


Glad to see you got the starter issue fixed. Called it!

I am actually quite surprised the auto parts store made that big of a goof up. Good work!

[BigTyla]

I am actually quite surprised the auto parts store made that big of a goof up. Good work!

You are?!?! LOL!

I remember getting an alternator for my 3S back in the day and they gave me a SOHC one even though I specified DOHC. AND it came in a box with a DOHC part number on it! I finally got a DOHC one and it was still the wrong amperage!

[n2nsanity]

it was a reman'd starter
it must have somehow fell into the wrong pile after reassembly
1st time i've ever seen the wrong part # on an actual part, have seen plenty of things in the wrong boxes from returns
so i always check first to make sure it matches inside and out of the box. that way at least they can't say i did it

guess those 2 fuses also fixed my speedo :)
they were labeled engine, head
so now all my guages work except the oil pressure, turn signals working now also
i have the part for that already, just need to crawl under and put it on
might wait til i have it up in the air again while i'm replacing the axles
that and the o2 installed, and i just have to tidy everything up
oh and figure out why my windows aren't working, that's pretty important too, although i have been just hotwiring them lol
anyway, with my guages working, i think i'm satisfied enough with everything to start putting my dash all back together

took her for another short ride today
hit 2nd a lil hard and wow, i've got some torque steer going on lol

[BigTyla]

Torque steer yay!

Wrong wheel drive FTW.

[Alex3000gt]

See you at the NG drags my friend. Glad the forum helped you get her running.

[IPD]

if you don't have torque steer, you wouldn't be driving a 3/s. ask chris about t2's torque steer. :eek:

[TUFFTR]

Congratulations mate! another successful 3.5L to the inventory, how does she feel compared to the 3L?
after driving a 3L DOHC manual and my 3.5L the extra torque it puts out is VERY noticeable! You dont really get much torque steer with the 3L at all...probably for the fact of it has none..

[IPD]

maybe that's just non-turbos. from a stop at ~2000 rpms, my car totally wants to yaw; and that's on 9b's (back when it was FWD).

[n2nsanity]

i'm still n/a, my last one had maybe the slightest bit when it was in it's prime, but it even that tiny bit was masked by all the suspension and alignment problems

this car wants to change lanes when i shift into 2nd, lol
think the 6puck clutch is having something to do with that too
it's really jumpy when starting out in 1st

[IPD]

could be the manual. the onset of power on 3/s FWD with a manual (or brake boosted atx) is more abrupt. it might be the clutch...but these cars are notorious for torque steer. it's a pretty common thing with most FWD cars though.

[TUFFTR]

maybe that's just non-turbos. from a stop at ~2000 rpms, my car totally wants to yaw; and that's on 9b's (back when it was FWD).

yeah I meant N/A FWD's lol, I wouldnt think a TT with the 450nm odd of torque would not have torque steer issues!

[BigTyla]

maybe that's just non-turbos. from a stop at ~2000 rpms, my car totally wants to yaw; and that's on 9b's (back when it was FWD).

Yeah I remember those days in the TT ATX. Good times. :D

[n2nsanity]

not sure what i did along the way, but now my power windows are working :)
power locks are acting up, but i'm not to worried about that

now working on my door panels and installing new speakers
if anyone has the +,- per wire color for each door, that'd be appreciated
i have it somewhere, but having trouble finding it

was gonna run all new wire from the speakers through the door, directly to the stereo
same for the back speakers, but the door doesn't really have a spot to run new wire unless i drill some holes
i'd like to ditch the stock radio wiring if i can

so, speakers, door panels and whatever i can get done with the dash is all i expect to get done today

[IPD]

what kind of speakers are you putting in? 6.75" are the best fit, imho...but you may have to put some spacers in there so they'll clear the retracted window.

[n2nsanity]

6.5" rockford fosgate prime's.
not top of the line or anything, but good enough for me and got a great deal on them, so this'll work for now

6.75 does fit best and usually line up with the original holes, but there's not much of a selection in that size

got the drivers door done, didn't even start on the passenger side yet
http://i53.tinypic.com/ab5ch5.jpg

bypassing the stock harness, at least for the speakers
http://i52.tinypic.com/6h3wv4.jpg
perfect size holes in the door connector and just poked a small hole in the grommet going under dash
loom obviously not big enough, will redo that later


this is just temporary as i'm missing the leather insert for this side
i suck at interior work, lol
http://i55.tinypic.com/16i606c.jpg

[n2nsanity]

got my ac controls installed yesterday
tested and everything works great, just need to flush my ac lines really good and recharge
haven't tested the new compressor out yet. i'm hoping for some nice cold air all summer tho

both rubber door to window trim pieces are done
door panels done on both sides
still gotta finish up the console and glovebox and get my stereo in

aside from interior, here's the more important stuff left:
o2 bung welded in and new o2 sensor installed
new slave cylinder
new axles and seals
after i put a few more miles on it, gear oil change, this time with synchromesh
ac flush and recharge, and still need to do new orings on firewall
low temp thermostat
registration, taxes, inspection and all that, so i can legally drive this thing
and repair the ps sideskirt clips and remount it

[ntcmpjg]

Like I told you yesterday you can use my AC stuff to flush it. I still have the gear oil too you can have

[n2nsanity]

thanks, i may take u up on that

on the sideskirt i was only able to salvage one of the push clips and added a screw in the wheelwell
it's not perfect, but good enough for now
http://i53.tinypic.com/psr5w.jpg


here's the tear in the bumper
was wondering if there is a way to mend it back together
http://i53.tinypic.com/2624m54.jpg


also, fixed that shifter safety cable problem
on the bottom of the ignition, u just unscrew the white plastic cover and it pretty much falls out
http://i54.tinypic.com/syv5t4.jpg

[IPD]

thanks, i may take u up on that

on the sideskirt i was only able to salvage one of the push clips and added a screw in the wheelwell
it's not perfect, but good enough for now
http://i53.tinypic.com/psr5w.jpg


here's the tear in the bumper
was wondering if there is a way to mend it back together
http://i53.tinypic.com/2624m54.jpg


also, fixed that shifter safety cable problem
on the bottom of the ignition, u just unscrew the white plastic cover and it pretty much falls out
http://i54.tinypic.com/syv5t4.jpg

only good way to fix bumpers is plastic-welding. urethane ftw. yes, you can fg/bondo it, but it won't be a uniform material, and it will potentially crack in the future if you do it.

[TUFFTR]

Remember folks, Fibreglass does not stick to plastic! your only real option that wont waste your time is just get either another bumper, or get it repaired like above, with urethane or the like

[n2nsanity]

i'm not going to spend more than a few $ on the repair if i even bother

getting a 99 front before the years over :)

[IPD]

i'm not going to spend more than a few $ on the repair if i even bother

getting a 99 front before the years over :)

the upside to having it plastic-welded is that you can re-sculpt it while you're at it. :)

i'd ask around on price. if you've already got the bumper pulled, it really doesn't take THAT much to get it welded; especially if it's not a gaping hole or anything. you're really just melting the two edges back together and finish sanding it.

[n2nsanity]

thanks for the info i'll look into it. it's about a 9 inch tear and that whole area under the tear has some pretty good wrinkles.

got the 170* thermostat in
took it for a drive, still seems way too hot under the hood to me, although my guage doesn't ever touch halfway

going out of town for a few days, so that means i have to somehow find time to finish all that other stuff next week
and try to make arrangements for someone to room with and someone to follow up
someone's gotta be passing through nc... no replies in my post for it though

[Alex3000gt]

thanks for the info i'll look into it. it's about a 9 inch tear and that whole area under the tear has some pretty good wrinkles.

got the 170* thermostat in
took it for a drive, still seems way too hot under the hood to me, although my guage doesn't ever touch halfway

going out of town for a few days, so that means i have to somehow find time to finish all that other stuff next week
and try to make arrangements for someone to room with and someone to follow up
someone's gotta be passing through nc... no replies in my post for it though

What about the 3SX crew?

[n2nsanity]

dunno if they're all going or not, i'll check
me and suthnr are only names on registration list from nc :(

not a whole lot done today

finished up complete ac system flush today, all new orings also. will charge it up tomorrow and see how it holds
anyone know if we have are supposed to have an orifice tube or some kind of filter somewhere? i didn't run across anything

drained and capped off heater core. it's being bypassed for now

installed new slave cylinder and bled lines. feels a little stiffer now
think i need to adjust the pedal again tho

[n2nsanity]

well, put 24oz in and compressor won't kick on
found a blown 20amp fuse, but that was for the condensor fan i think
replacing that didn't help
quite a few things to test now

no ac will suck

good news, the o2 bung is only going to cost about $30 installed
hopefully get that done today or tomorrow

[95gto]

well, put 24oz in and compressor won't kick on
found a blown 20amp fuse, but that was for the condensor fan i think
replacing that didn't help
quite a few things to test now

no ac will suck

good news, the o2 bung is only going to cost about $30 installed
hopefully get that done today or tomorrow

Is the ac controller under the glove box plugged in? If not your compressor will never engage. It's the little black box attached with the lower dash plastic under the glove box that also has some venting molded into it.

[n2nsanity]

didn't think that's what it did exactly
it is plugged in tho
some of my parts got mixed up, but is the same part# as the other ones i have
i could try another in case somehow this one is randomly bad

i'm leaning towards bad connection on the clutch wire tho

[Alex3000gt]

dunno if they're all going or not, i'll check
me and suthnr are only names on registration list from nc :(

not a whole lot done today

finished up complete ac system flush today, all new orings also. will charge it up tomorrow and see how it holds
anyone know if we have are supposed to have an orifice tube or some kind of filter somewhere? i didn't run across anything

drained and capped off heater core. it's being bypassed for now

installed new slave cylinder and bled lines. feels a little stiffer now
think i need to adjust the pedal again tho

Email or PM Suthnr, otherwise it is going to be a lonely trip!

[n2nsanity]

got the o2 bung and sensor in. now just have to put the downpipe back on and fish the wire through the floor.
http://i53.tinypic.com/a9ldnl.jpg

while waiting on the downpipe to get done i went ahead and drained the gear oil and pulled the old axle apart.
inner axle wasn't too bad to get off and it slid on to the new axle fairly easy
http://i53.tinypic.com/2w6ctjb.jpg

before i put it back in i'm going to replace the axle seal. hopefully i have the right one

also need to install the oil pressure sender

[n2nsanity]

well, not much progress today

got the axle seal in at least
old one came out fairly easy with a plastic prybar
put some oil on the new one and it wasn't too bad to get in


almost forgot about the broken lug nut stud
they're usually fairly easy to replace
not this time, thanks to this abs ring

broken lug stud
http://i54.tinypic.com/14t3a7c.jpg

back of knuckle
http://i54.tinypic.com/28tdz5k.jpg

abs ring is all kinds of iin the way
and i'm having a hard time getting the bearing out
any help with this would be appreciated

i'm trying to just get a whole knuckle and control arm from a local guy
seems like the easiest option for now
if u look closely, you can see my ball joint is also shot

[TUFFTR]

Ring around tyre joints and or local mechanics and see what the going rate is (if anyone knows how to get it out)
But hey, good excuse for new lower control arms! :D

[n2nsanity]

waiting to see when i can get the control arm/knuckle/hub from this guy
i'm cutting time so close, it's not even funny

guess as soon as i can get some free time, while i'm waiting, i should work on this
http://i54.tinypic.com/5ygoe9.jpg
having a hard time getting that plug out so i can get the oil pressure sender installed
is it just me, or is the oil pressure switch in the wrong hole?
or does it not matter which goes where?
and if so, and i can't get this plug out, which of the 2 would you prefer? i'm thinking the guage


then i still need to put the axle in, it's ready and should be fairly easy, new axle seal is already in
fill up trans with synchromesh
downpipe on and route o2 through floor, still have to find the right hole, think it's behind the heatshield
figure out why my ac compressor clutch isn't engaging
test out the radiator fan
secure the battery
find a helmet
probably going to need an alignment
registration/taxes/inspection
hopefully squeeze in a good 2 hour test drive somewhere
and also if i don't get my stereo in, i'm gonna be bored out of my mind on the road lol
last minute oil change, coolant flush, gas up and go

i really hope that's it, because i don't know if i can handle anything else :(

[TUFFTR]

nah mate it's in the right hole! I used an allen key type fitting in a 1/2" socket, in which i attached a 1/2" breaker bar to it and it came out. It's VERY stubborn to say the least.
Just me or the cable going to your oil pressure switch now capable of running a small amplifier? look thick as!

[n2nsanity]

i did the same thing to get that plug out, but sprayed some acetone/atf on it 1st
thought i broke something when it finally popped and broke free
the switch wasn't in it's normal spot. it's typically on the inside and gauge sender is on the outside. don't think it matters tho
but guage might get a better reading being right on the oil pump

its just u, lol. i reloomed, heatshrinked, and retaped a lot of the harness
you're just seeing heatshrink and tape. i did everything in red, so it's easier to see.
i had everything out, so figured y not

few things i can cross off the list
axle is in
downpipe back on
o2 sensor installed and connected, finally...
synchromesh in the trans

this whole broken lug stud deal is killing me. if i can that taken care of before the weekend is over, i should be good
ac is tedious, but usually simple problems
thing that's getting me is the ac light isn't flashing. usually it flashes when something isn't working

[n2nsanity]

on top of the broken lug stud, here's some of my other mess
http://i54.tinypic.com/33trtxu.jpg
guess i didn't tighten the oil pressure switch enough, it's got a good leak going on


got lucky and found a used control arm/knuckle/hub for only $50
everything about it was in better condition than my old one
no broken stud, no torn ball joint boot, no play in the hub
anyway it's in for the most part
got dark on me, so no more work or pics tonight

[Alex3000gt]

Keep it up man! You are almost there.

[n2nsanity]

Yay, 5 lug studs
http://i53.tinypic.com/105o2ok.jpg

but, now i think i need a new tie rod end :(
and a new drain pan, because mine grew wings and flew away last night

and tightening didn't work, still leaking
i'm about to just do without the oil pressure guage cap that hole off again

[TUFFTR]

Bahhahahahaah you poor bastard, always something!
In regards to the oil pressure fitting, did you use thread tape on it? Every oil fitting i use I ALWAYS ALWAYS use thread tape and have never had one leak.

Also, if screwing into the oil pump, be careful not to over tighten it :D or else you'll split the oil pump casing and have to change an oil pump just like me :D

[n2nsanity]

i used teflon tape. that's what it looked like was on the threads when i pulled from the other block

ok, i'm done messing around. capping that hole back off. the oem guages or sender's aren't that reliable anyway. and a new sender is like $50

bout to go pick one of these up. not bad for $10 and comes with everything except the T, which i already have.
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/wcsstore/CVWEB/staticproductimage//N3342C/large/17122009_acn_cp8216_pri_larg.jpg

[SOHC]

Would you sell the torque converter separately or are you selling the whole trans in one piece?

[n2nsanity]

doesn't matter to me

[n2nsanity]

found a transmission drain plug that seems to be a perfect fit for capping off the oil pressure switch sensor hole
added a little rtv and tightened it nice and snug. much easier with a hex head bolt instead of a recessed allen head bolt
i will be soooo pissed if it leaks
moved the oil pressure switch to the hole on the oil pump
added the T and installed the new oil pressure guage
installed the new tie rod end
now just need to add some oil and start her up and cross my fingers and hope there are no leaks

also, got plates on the car
insured, legal, don't need an inspection til june 2012
ready to rock :)

[n2nsanity]

Bahhahahahaah you poor bastard, always something!
In regards to the oil pressure fitting, did you use thread tape on it? Every oil fitting i use I ALWAYS ALWAYS use thread tape and have never had one leak.

Also, if screwing into the oil pump, be careful not to over tighten it :D or else you'll split the oil pump casing and have to change an oil pump just like me :D

that sucks man
lot of work over something so simple
i know all about that lol

[n2nsanity]

still leaking, but much less than before, so i'm trying again
pulled that plug and cleaned everything with brake cleaner
the crush washer i had on was literally crushed lol
this time i used a copper washer and heavily coated the drain plug in black rtv
gonna let it sit at least 24 hours before putting oil back in the engine and see what happens
if no leaks this time, i owe thanks again to chris from ninjaperformance
if it does somehow still leak, i'm going to have to weld it shut or something
i feel much more positive it will work this time tho

also, i tested the ac compressor clutch
it definitely works when applying power directly to it
this is a reman'd compressor, and i forgot that it was heavily painted, to include the pins for the 2 sensors on the compressor
i hit them really good with a wire brush and reconnected them
wish i would have thought of this before i put everything together
anyway, worst case scenario, i can wire a switch directly to the clutch and i will have ac, but i'm really hoping what cleaning those connectors fixed it
if anyone has any other ideas why the compressor clutch wouldn't engage, please chime in

i'm going to be optimistic and say i think i have it all figured out
sucks i have to wait til wednesday morning to test the oil leak and ac
but i guess while i'm waiting i can wire up the stereo, finish up interior and give her a good wash, and be packing :)


crushed crush washer
http://i51.tinypic.com/9liatv.jpg
i'm pretty sure this is why it was leaking last time, even without any sealant
was a very slow drip, but i'm not having that

[Alex3000gt]

Are you here yet?

[n2nsanity]

hopefully sometime tomorrow afternoon/evening
went to a shop today for that leak because i go tired of messing with it
was doing great for about 20 minutes, then it started a slow leak again
so, i ended up redoing it again. i think this is the 5th or 6th time now.
using permatex right stuff ultra gray this time and torqued the shit out of that bolt
letting it dry for several hours even though the tube says 1 minute
it better work at $30 per tube
this will be the last time i do this. if it fails this time, i'm going to get that hole welded shut
i'm so kicking myself in the ass for ever pulling that plug to begin with

also, think the reman'd compressor i installed has bad sensors
only other thing i can think of unless there's something wrong with wiring
also, it appears to be leaking
i swear everything seems like garbage these days
i don't care if it's 10 x more expensive i'm going to stick with only new parts with a warranty

[MR 3KGT]

Good job overall i was trying to get ahold of you on the way home from work . finally got a text from you after id already seen the wife so you know i was stuck in the house for the night. i you working on car tonight i wanna stop by and check you out.

[n2nsanity]

wow, apparently my car and the weather really don't want me to go :(
my oil leak is somehow worse today
if not for this ridiculous weather, i'd at least have a 1% possibility in finding some miraculous way to get this thing fixed and be on the road in

i was supposed to have left 8 hours ago

i'm really hating myself right now...
all this because i just had to have the stock oil guage
there's at least 5 routes i could've taken and still had an oil guage, but somehow i took the worst possible one

[n2nsanity]

anyone have a time machine i can borrow?
if i could just go back 1 week, and leave that one bolt alone...

i'm absolutely not going to make it to indy. was supposed to have been there 7 hours ago anyway

today was fun...
was desperately trying to get this thing on the road
i crammed in a good 2 days worth of work
got pretty much everything done except for the oil leak
it's leaking just as bad as yesterday :(

oh and i also kinda got hit by lightning
that was interesting
i think the charge has finally worn off, so i'm gonna go pass out


for anyone that is ever tempted to remove anything like this.... DON'T!
http://i53.tinypic.com/v8215c.jpg

here's why
http://i52.tinypic.com/15fheg8.jpg


oh and don't ever touch anything metal during a thunderstorm, especially if you're soaking wet, it might bite

[TUFFTR]

Thats not a hairline crack i see above it is it :S or is that just a casting imperfection in the metal?

Man I feel so sorry for you, nothing pisses a home mechanic off MORE then when he touches something that didn't need to be originally touched, and has now fucked it.
god I know the feeling all too well!

[BigTyla]

Happens all the time to even the best mechanics. Don't get too worked up over it.

[n2nsanity]

its a crack :(

so now what?

[BigTyla]

Pics are blocked at work so I can't tell what crack you're talking about here. Is it a crack at the mounting surface of the oil pressure switch?

[n2nsanity]

yep, it's on the right side and goes in towards the block
might be one on the opposite side also, but hard to tell as the oil pump is there
but that gasket should contain it if so

[BigTyla]

How far back does the crack go? I can see it clearly near the plug but I can't tell if it traverses really deep. I really can't tell you the best way to repair that. How fast is the leak?

[IPD]

jb weld that bitch?

[TUFFTR]

Do it once do it right, get it welded up properly

[GTwizard]

You need to have a better understanding of threads. That trans plug you are trying to use will NEVER work. The allen head plugs are a tappered thread like pipe thread. The plug u are trying to use is a strait cut machine thread and not for that application at all.
My $.02
Sorry you did not make it.

[n2nsanity]

this plug is also a tapered head plug
i tried everything i could think of, including taking it to a shop.
found the crack wednesday night and finally gave up thursday around midnight after the jbweld didn't work
no way i was going to make it at that point....
i'm pretty sure it was screwed from the first time i removed that allen head bolt, but kept getting worse the more i messed with it

[TUFFTR]

all good things come to those who wait. she'll be fixed soon and better then ever man.
Whats the go from here now?
can you just get the whole area welded up?

[DrGonzo]

Damn how am I just finding this thread... WTH man why didn't you get a hold of me!! We could have knocked all of this out is a day or so...LOL

JB weld should have held, but you need to prep the surface first. hit it with some 60 - 80 grit sand paper to rough up the area and remove the black block coating "JB weld wont stick to that shit". Don't use the quick shit either. Use the original and wait 24 hours. Make sure it is bone dry and no oil on any of the matting surfaces. Any oil will cause it to not bond to the metal.

[GTwizard]

Any sanding grit that gets in that oil galley, and your done. It will go strait to the motor. Do be carfull.

[DrGonzo]

Any sanding grit that gets in that oil galley, and your done. It will go strait to the motor. Do be carfull.

Yes, Be sure to leave the plug in when sanding it down. Probably best to just JB weld over the plug and the crack. That should stop it from leaking.

[n2nsanity]

i left the plug in
sanded, filed, used drill/wirebrush, soaked it in brake cleaner
jbwelded the hell out of it. used an entire kit on it
covered everything in "right stuff - ultra gray"
let it sit for like 7 or 8 hours... still leaking

i had a little run in with lightning that same day and was a really rough week for me
guess it just wasn't meant to be

last wednesday or thursday i was ready to pay someone $500 to make this problem go away

your help is welcome anytime

[n2nsanity]

just to add some closure to this
i dropped it off at a shop a couple months ago to get welded up
took him forever to get to it, just brought it home last weekend
he hooked me up at $125 and also installed my ps axle for me, not a bad deal :)
wish he would have been available when i needed it right before ng11
oh well, i should definitely be ready for ng12 :)

she's needs a little tlc, but running great and not the slightest oil leak now

[Alex3000gt]

just to add some closure to this
i dropped it off at a shop a couple months ago to get welded up
took him forever to get to it, just brought it home last weekend
he hooked me up at $125 and also installed my ps axle for me, not a bad deal :)
wish he would have been available when i needed it right before ng11
oh well, i should definitely be ready for ng12 :)

she's needs a little tlc, but running great and not the slightest oil leak now


That's a good start. Hope to see you at NG12.