View Full Version : The Quest to fit 10 Inch Wide Rims on the front.!
well, huge rims have come down to the point were anyone can afford them...and I'm sticking it out to see if I can get some 10" wide rims on the front (since it's doing the steering and the biggest track problem our cars have is front oversteer eventually) so gents, anyone with 10" rims or attempted to fit them and kept the mock up pix POST THEM UP!
Specifically I've found some rims in 19x10 that come in offsets from +20 to +48 so it's now a case of working out what I can and can't do with regards to brake's hitting rims and how close to the shock body I can get
Legally I need an offset of ~30-48 (total vehicle track is not allowed to exceed 1" more than stock) but again depends on brakes + shocks.
http://www.aspecwheels.net/index.php?route=product/product&path=20_401_423_838_846&product_id=1142
Far North Racing - Stealth - Tires and Wheels (http://farnorthracing.com/stealth/tires_and_wheels.html)
You cannot eliminate understeer (that's the proper term for "front oversteer") using tire widths, unless you are willing to run wider front tires than your rear tires.
Understeer is a natural feature of an AWD with a front weight bias and a near 50/50 torque split. It can be reduced, but never eliminated. Think of the car as a FWD than can put power down.
DG
I figure it should atleast help, I know there is no miracle cure :)
caliper clearance is NOT a function of offset; it's a function of spoke design. i wish i'd understood this better when i was shopping for mine...so i'll repeat myself for the sake of clarity:
CALIPER CLEARANCE IS A FUNCTION OF SPOKE DESIGN, NOT HUB OFFSET.
how do i know this? because a 24mm offset wheel and a 35mm offset wheel WITH THE EXACT SAME SPOKE DESIGN will clear the same calipers with identical clearance. this is why 3/s owners can tell you offhand what offset on what width will work with the stock perches--but finding compatible spoke designs is a hodge-podge of luck.
what you really need to do is figure out what's the largest amount of wheel you can place inboard with any given suspension/coilover setup, and go with that. i'm confidant that you could probably run 285's on 10" rims up front--provided you had coilovers & spokes which cleared the calipers. not a lot of 3/s owners are running 10" up front. one of the things i heard when i was shopping is that the fnorks in 9.5" size have a different spoke design than in 10". keep that in mind; just because "size 1" fits the brakes doesn't mean "size 2" will also fit the brakes.
my suggestion? get a caliper outline & use it to size/judge the rims you want to use. most BBK mfgs have these available for download on their website; someone on here may have one for the 1g/2g tt brakes. in all liklihood though, you'll probably end up with a forged 1-piece wheel; as the nature of this application demands a more "open" spoke design to accommodate the large brake calipers.
p.s.
my guess is you might be able to swing 35mm offset 18x10's on the front, but pay close attention to what suspension you use & the spoke design you decide upon. function > form in this case. if, by some miracle, you can fit more inboard than that, you can always shave the hub surface a little bit. or you can try to run 40/45mm's and pray to god you don't need 1" spacers.
p.p.s.
according to: http://www.1010tires.com/wheeloffsetcalculator.asp
going from 8.5" 45mm offset to 10" 32mm offset; you'll be +6mm inboard and +32mm outboard. so around 1 1/4" extra outboard. 45mm makes it +19/+19. i don't know if there's a full inch available to go INBOARD (i certainly don't think so with the stock perch) so just an fyi. but 1/2" spacers will turn +45mm offset wheels into +32mm wheels (and provide a bit extra caliper clearance as well). like i said though, my GT-C's are 24mm offset and need spacers to clear the calipers. they stick out quite a bit.
you "might" try rolling the front fender out--to help "disguise" the width.
Yep I use that site all the time...I'm still keen for pictures of what other people are running to get an idea, and from what I've seen of my current strut clearance I should be able to clear a 38mm 10" rim...I'm just kinda keen to see how bad people are finding their rims when they have go to a 10" size..i3igpete has 10" rims for example so I'm hoping to get some info/pix from him.
fwiw my 38mm offset 8.5" rims can fit a 17mm socket easily between the tyre sidewall and the current coilovers...I can also EASILY move the top of the shock inboard by an inch and adjust the lower mounting to keep the camber right which should give another 5mm or so.
I am running a BBK that sticks out LESS far than stock brakes so I should be doing well there too.
i wouldn't think you'd have to adjust camber at all if it was set right to begin with. flat level is flat level. putting an extra inch inboard or outboard shouldn't require camber adjustment if it was flat level to begin with.
now if you've got some rake in there, then yes, you might need to adjust. personally, i wouldn't try and mess with suspension/alignment. i'd go with rolled fenders/bolted on flares before i did that. seriously, if mine was a track car, i wouldn't care if i had FG fenders pop-riveted on there--if it meant that the car passed inspection.
p.s.
come to think of it, 42/45mm rims might not be bad...if you're getting the same sizes on all four. provided the spokes clear the calipers, all you'd need to do is maybe run spacers up front. the rears would probably fit without any issues. again though, the calipers can be a BITCH to fit over. tt brakes won't fit mine at all. i guarantee 355's would fit without so much as a scrape.
the camber is not exactly what I mean...the camber does not change...the angle that the shock is at does....you know how you can adjust the strut top? making sense?
but yeah i recon it'd fit...I just want more info as to what I'm up for..
second problem is I don't really have access to the wheels...getting a brake template is no issue....I want a wheel template! :p
GTOJOE
02-22-2011, 06:08 AM
Better offset calculator
Custom rims, wheel tire packages for your ride - RIMSnTIRES.com (http://www.rimsntires.com/specs.jsp)
&
http://www.kouki.co.uk/utilities/visual-tyre-size-calculator
Why do you need 10" rims on the front? why not just go with 9"? will be much easier to find. Also when looking for wheels try Element Custom Wheels Tires, Wheel Tire Packages,Cheap Rims,Car Wheels (http://www.elementwheels.com) and tell it what car you have and it will give you a list of all wheels that fit. Of all the sites I visited it had the most. And for the wheels I want it said they are "guaranteed to fit your car" which is more than any other site said. Once you have found the wheels you want get them cheaper from other sites like aspec.
those are some good links. i just picked one without tire-size calculations, because it's fairly easy to determine what works as far as tires go.
one thing i DID learn from that link though (thx, btw) is that the stock tire combos have 1" upsize on the rims to the tires. 8" wide rims use 9" wide tires. 8.5" rims use 9.5" tires. (approximately on all of these). which actually makes the 10" rim 11" tire (285) a very, very good upsize match for our cars.
imho, i think 10" all around is a very good size, and i've been using it since 2007. only thing i "might" change would be to go with slightly more offset--if i could figure out a way to do it. but i'm already 4-7mm more inboard on these than stock. i think i could do it though...now that i have coilovers.
I figure it should at least help
It won't.
Understeer/oversteer is a measure of the balance of the grip on the car. A car that understeers loses grip on the front first. A car that oversteers loses grip on the rear first.
By fitting wider tires, you (in theory) raise the limits of the car, meaning that the point where the car loses grip will be higher up than it was before. But the ratio of when it loses grip will be unchanged.
In order to change the understeer/oversteer balance via changing tire widths, you will have to run wider tires on the front than on the rear. Because the understeer in the car is largely built in (due to AWD and weight distribution) to make any real difference in understeer/oversteer balance through tire widths will require the fronts to be very much wider than the rears - like 285s on the front and 235s on the rear.
I tried something like that on my race car, early on (235s on the front, 205s on the rear, in a BFG R1 race compound) and it worked in some situations, but it also limited the maximum amount of grip in the rear and there were times when I needed more absolute grip out of the rears, so I abandoned the experiment.
90% of the understeer complaints I see are driver induced and cannot be fixed via mechanical means. Go ahead and fit super-wide tires on the front if you wish, but be aware that it will not cure your understeer issue.
DG
GTOJOE
02-22-2011, 09:33 AM
Thicker sway bar in the rear?
GTOJOE
02-22-2011, 09:42 AM
one thing i DID learn from that link though (thx, btw) is that the stock tire combos have 1" upsize on the rims to the tires. 8" wide rims use 9" wide tires. 8.5" rims use 9.5" tires. (approximately on all of these).
That's because wheels are measured from the inside lip to the other inside lip while tyres are measure from the outer sidewall to the other outer sidewall.
http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm289/1STGENGTO/Wheelmeasurements.jpg
Thicker sway bar in the rear?
Doesn't work - well, doesn't work as expected.
The thicker rear sway bar attempts to reduce grip on the rear by increasing the amount of rear weight transfer. Normally, that increases oversteer.
But AWD cars have a differential connecting the front and rear wheels. When you apply power, the differential "senses" (that's a gross oversimplification of a complex action but we can treat it this way) that the rear has less grip and routes the power forward - where it induces understeer.
However, that rear sway bar is still there, doing it's best to unstick the rear. So in instances where the differential isn't playing games, it induces oversteer.
What you wind up with is a car that, in the main, understeers, but every once and a while snap-oversteers with very little warning - and the more rear spring/bar you put in it, the worse it gets.
The 3S has a rear-torque-bias centre diff so the problem should be a little less prevalent, and indeed, the 3S will rotate a little with throttle before the understeer takes over. But any car that can sent large amounts of power forward will understeer.
I set up AWD race cars with just the slightest bit of spring/bar oversteer bias, so you can get the rear dancing on rapid transitions and lift throttle, and I prefer to do it with spring rather than bar (after a series of aftermarket rear bars, I eventually went back to a OEM rear bar) The 3S, with it's rear-torque-bias centre diff, probably needs even less rear spring.
The other issue here is that the 3S has McStruts on the front, so it has horrible (which is to say, very little) camber gain in roll. The way you normally combat this is to run a lot of front bar, and I expect that a good way to reduce understeer on a 3S is to thicken up the front bar a lot.
However, once you get to the point where you are lifting the inside front clear of the ground - normally the hot ticket on a car like an M3 or Mustang - that differential issue rears up. Lifting the inside front under power is going to cause all three diffs to go insane.
So on a 3S... well, the main issue with a 3S is "doctor, it hurts when I do this" so the solution is to "don't do that" and get a car with less Weird Harolds (like a C5 Corvette) for track use. But if you are bound and determined to use the 3S, the answer is probably more front bar, as the lack of camber gain in the front is the single largest problem. Quaife front diff, Quaife centre diff (assuming that doesn't remove the rear torque bias feature, which is pretty important) and leave the rear viscous.
Street car, larger front bar and be done with it.
DG
It won't.
Understeer/oversteer is a measure of the balance of the grip on the car. A car that understeers loses grip on the front first. A car that oversteers loses grip on the rear first.
By fitting wider tires, you (in theory) raise the limits of the car, meaning that the point where the car loses grip will be higher up than it was before. But the ratio of when it loses grip will be unchanged.
In order to change the understeer/oversteer balance via changing tire widths, you will have to run wider tires on the front than on the rear. Because the understeer in the car is largely built in (due to AWD and weight distribution) to make any real difference in understeer/oversteer balance through tire widths will require the fronts to be very much wider than the rears - like 285s on the front and 235s on the rear.
I tried something like that on my race car, early on (235s on the front, 205s on the rear, in a BFG R1 race compound) and it worked in some situations, but it also limited the maximum amount of grip in the rear and there were times when I needed more absolute grip out of the rears, so I abandoned the experiment.
90% of the understeer complaints I see are driver induced and cannot be fixed via mechanical means. Go ahead and fit super-wide tires on the front if you wish, but be aware that it will not cure your understeer issue.
DG
sorry, I'm obviously not being clear...by "I figure it will help" I don't mean with the balance, I mean with the overall performance of the car.
mb7050
02-22-2011, 04:27 PM
i have 9.5 wide rims and they sit flush with stock front fenders w +42 offset.
i have 9.5 wide rims and they sit flush with stock front fenders w +42 offset.
on stock perches????
Can I see pictures? this is awesome :)
2fnloud
02-22-2011, 05:53 PM
i have 9.5 wide rims and they sit flush with stock front fenders w +42 offset.
What car? your spyder or SL?
i don't think it would matter if it was fwd, awd, spyder, or coupe. rims should fit the same; it's just caliper clearance that differs.
2fnloud
02-22-2011, 06:02 PM
Good point, plus I was confusing MB7050 with another member that has a spyder and a 99 SL.
GTOJOE
02-22-2011, 06:53 PM
Doesn't work - well, doesn't work as expected.
The thicker rear sway bar attempts to reduce grip on the rear by increasing the amount of rear weight transfer. Normally, that increases oversteer.
But AWD cars have a differential connecting the front and rear wheels. When you apply power, the differential "senses" (that's a gross oversimplification of a complex action but we can treat it this way) that the rear has less grip and routes the power forward - where it induces understeer.
However, that rear sway bar is still there, doing it's best to unstick the rear. So in instances where the differential isn't playing games, it induces oversteer.
What you wind up with is a car that, in the main, understeers, but every once and a while snap-oversteers with very little warning - and the more rear spring/bar you put in it, the worse it gets.
The 3S has a rear-torque-bias centre diff so the problem should be a little less prevalent, and indeed, the 3S will rotate a little with throttle before the understeer takes over. But any car that can sent large amounts of power forward will understeer.
I set up AWD race cars with just the slightest bit of spring/bar oversteer bias, so you can get the rear dancing on rapid transitions and lift throttle, and I prefer to do it with spring rather than bar (after a series of aftermarket rear bars, I eventually went back to a OEM rear bar) The 3S, with it's rear-torque-bias centre diff, probably needs even less rear spring.
The other issue here is that the 3S has McStruts on the front, so it has horrible (which is to say, very little) camber gain in roll. The way you normally combat this is to run a lot of front bar, and I expect that a good way to reduce understeer on a 3S is to thicken up the front bar a lot.
However, once you get to the point where you are lifting the inside front clear of the ground - normally the hot ticket on a car like an M3 or Mustang - that differential issue rears up. Lifting the inside front under power is going to cause all three diffs to go insane.
So on a 3S... well, the main issue with a 3S is "doctor, it hurts when I do this" so the solution is to "don't do that" and get a car with less Weird Harolds (like a C5 Corvette) for track use. But if you are bound and determined to use the 3S, the answer is probably more front bar, as the lack of camber gain in the front is the single largest problem. Quaife front diff, Quaife centre diff (assuming that doesn't remove the rear torque bias feature, which is pretty important) and leave the rear viscous.
Street car, larger front bar and be done with it.
DG
Doesn't a larger bar on the front typically increase understeer? My understanding is very basic. from what I have read in magazines etc.
Soooo IPD...where's your piccies!!! :p
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:45 PM
i have custom made camber plates and shite tein coilovers
http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/8288/69966666.jpg
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:48 PM
-1.5 camber up front
looks fantastic...any chance of some pix from the insides showing your shock clearance etc?
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:50 PM
there is about 3-5mm clearance. Iīll take pic sometime
awesome :) so you had to have custom camber plates to bring the top of the shock all the way in?
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:53 PM
not all the way but some
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:54 PM
i had to make custom plates because shitty tein plates cracked
2fnloud
02-24-2011, 09:55 PM
mb7050, what rims are those?
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:56 PM
enkei rp03 but beware these wheels canīt stand real driving :(
2fnloud
02-24-2011, 09:58 PM
enkei rp03 but beware these wheels canīt stand real driving :(
what do you mean? They break, bend?
mb7050
02-24-2011, 09:59 PM
bend real easily
2fnloud
02-24-2011, 10:12 PM
you've bent one?
mb7050
02-24-2011, 10:34 PM
yap 2 both rears they can be fixed but they bend easily
GTOJOE
02-24-2011, 10:39 PM
Wow lucky I didn't buy them. My current wheels cracked due to not handling the abuse I give them and I desperately wanted a set of RP03. Just bought some XXR that should be a stronger design.
Soooo IPD...where's your piccies!!! :p
you do realize i'm still in the f**king sandbox, right?
what the hell is the sandbox?
it's somewhere in the vicinity of this:
http://http://static.funnyjunk.com/pictures/ground_zero_ocean.jpg
ok I played around with how far the strut will allow me to move it back...this is essentially adjust two places.
The idea is to pull the strut to plate inboard (Picture 1) to it's maximum adjustment, see how in the first picture I've still got around 1cm of adjustment before I need to get a custom plate? well to stuff around with it I pulled it further in (maximum adjustment) and ended up with around 5mm of additional clearance..
before I move on I'd also like to look at adjusting the plate to allow for more castor as well..seeing as there appears to be a fair amount of room on all sides of the spring.
before adjustment:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/Wide%20Wheel%20Project/Beforeplate.JPG
showing how you could modify the plate:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/Wide%20Wheel%20Project/Beforeplatered.jpg
showing how much space there is around the spring even at maximum adjustment
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/Wide%20Wheel%20Project/topstrutclearance.JPG
to maintain your camber you then need to push the hub knuckle back out...this is what actually forces the lip of the Rim away from the shock/spring as opposed to just giving bucketloads of camber
before adjustment:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/Wide%20Wheel%20Project/knuckle1.JPG
After Adjustment:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/Wide%20Wheel%20Project/knuckle2.JPG
showing how you could egg it a little more (red is stock, yellow egging it a bit more)
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/Wide%20Wheel%20Project/knuckle3.jpg
SOO, the end result with toying around with all this is I now have ~36mm of clearance between the tyre/rim and the spring...funny as the 19x10+42's should only need an additional 26mm...so I could fit a +46 mm offset 19x10 rim...assuming the spokes cleared! :p which means that MY CAR WOULD BE LEGAL IN AUSTRALIA YAY!
now I just need to find someone willing to sell the XXR's in +46 offset as opposed to the +42 that's everywhere...I may end up settling for a +42 though, and just flairing the guards slighly (will stick out 12mm more than the current rims do.)
and, I need to try the 6kg springs on the front and see if it makes the car more livable.
ok, showing the strut top at full adjustment....nothing really fancy about it...just showing space around it for more adjustment
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/DSC00325.JPG
and here is the 6kg springs from the rear set of shocks:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/DSC00326.JPG
They are actually coiled 4mm thinner...does not make them fit on the front shocks so well...showing stock front vs rear coil:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/DSC00327.JPG
and this shot shows the TOTAL travel compressing that the teins have...pretty shit...I'd say somewhere around 2-3" maximum (once you talk droop + the top hat that sits over the shaft...)
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/DSC00328.JPG
what it looks like on
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/DSC00329.JPG
and showing that the 6kg coil can not hold the front of the car's weight at ALL and as such the car just sits on the bump stops (1-1.5" down the full shock travel)
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/teins/DSC00330.JPG
Fucking YAY.
mb7050
02-27-2011, 08:37 AM
my plates allow same adjustments as teins but are just stronger .
damn...ever considered making them able to be moved further back for more castor?
mb7050
02-27-2011, 10:00 AM
not really i didnīt want to change the front suspension geometry too much.
stealthTT
03-01-2011, 11:55 AM
great thread.
My wheels are 9,5 ET35 and rear 10.5 ET35, all on 19" - they are Volk GR2 Vr.2 (New TE37 Vr. 2)
however, they dont clear the rear oem calipers - but thats not a problem as I will upgrade them.
Michael: I like those wheels that you've found , pretty cheap and they look great, also they might fit.
I wish I have invested less in my wheels and have bought some other upgraded parts.
are these KSport brakes? it looks so oem having them painted black :)
Doesn't a larger bar on the front typically increase understeer?
On a car with a proper front suspension, all else being equal, yes.
On a car with a McStrut, the car has crappy (which is to say, minimal) camber gain in roll. Where a double A-arm can be designed to increase the amount of negative camber in roll (so as to keep the tire flat on the roll as the car rolls), that cannot be done with a McStrut. So the more roll you have, the less tire you have on the ground.
(Well, it's more about the pressure loading across the face of the tire, rather than physically prying part of the tire off the ground, but the net effect is the same)
The ticker front bar resists the roll. Less roll means more tire contact, which is more grip. The bigger bar also means more weight transfer, which means less grip (this is the mechanism that usually increases oversteer with a big front bar) But the grip *gained* due to correcting camber is greater than the grip *lost* due to weight transfer, so the net effect is a grip gain.
This works right up to the point where the inside tire is lifted off the ground, at which point all your grip comes from the outside tire. This is a common setup on McStrut cars like Mustangs, Camaros, and 1990s M3s.
Better one happy tire and one pissed off tire than two pissed off tires.
On an AWD, this works up to the point where you lift the inside tire off the ground - then the diffs go crazy. So you can get more grip with a front bar, but you can't get as much as you can with a RWD with the same suspension (and a thicker front bar).
DG
mb7050
03-01-2011, 01:51 PM
lots of - camber up front helps to reduce understeer
That doesn't work.
When you run a lot of static negative camber, what you are really doing is trying to predict what the ultimate roll angle is, and set the static camber angle such that at full roll, the *dynamic* camber is optimal. That's fine, except that with reasonably sticky tires and stock springs/bars, you can easily see 3-5 degrees of roll, which means you need 3-5 degrees of static negative camber to compensate. That has serious consequences to straight line grip (accel and braking) and to tire wear. Plus the wrong side tire is now looking at negtive 6-10 degrees of dynamic camber and contributing very little to grip.
You're far better off to reduce the maximum amount of roll with a thicker front bar. You still have to set static negative to compensate, but now you're looking at 1-2 degrees static negative which is a lot easier to deal with. Plus you are trasferring load onto the happy tire which is better able to deal with it.
DG
mb7050
03-01-2011, 02:22 PM
Iīm not an expert with this stuff at all but i tracked my old 3000gt few times and noticed it helps alot with all stock drivetrain and stock bars.
posting this video once again . From puma crew " front suspension -3" lowered and front camber -6 in this race and 245 tires"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUD6QxfS_YM
great thread.
My wheels are 9,5 ET35 and rear 10.5 ET35, all on 19" - they are Volk GR2 Vr.2 (New TE37 Vr. 2)
however, they dont clear the rear oem calipers - but thats not a problem as I will upgrade them.
Michael: I like those wheels that you've found , pretty cheap and they look great, also they might fit.
I wish I have invested less in my wheels and have bought some other upgraded parts.
are these KSport brakes? it looks so oem having them painted black :)
oh nice! can I have some a few pictures?
and yeah they are Ksports, I'm a huge fan of the OEM look, completely blacked out cars look very UN oem though sooo :| the clearing of the rear caliper will be an interesting one. I ordered the 522's so we'll see what we end up with in a few weeks!
Went with the Gold 522's in 19x10 ET 42, so in theory it should look a bit like:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/wrx.jpg
and
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/P45r/vr4slammed.jpg
:p
mb7050
03-01-2011, 03:44 PM
mmmmmmm i like concave
Iīm not an expert with this stuff at all but i tracked my old 3000gt few times and noticed it helps alot with stock drivetrain and stock bars.
posting this video once again . front suspension -3" lowered and front camber -6 in this race
Thicken up the front bar, take out half the camber, and watch your cornering grip shoot up and your braking distance drop by half.
The wider the tires, the more camber sensitive the car is.
DG
stealthTT
03-02-2011, 12:09 AM
I'm anxious to see if they fit :)
I tried mine in front, 10.5 et35, with the Tein coilovers and they are hitting the suspension.
They look great :)
thats Dragi's car, the 99. and the wheels are Rota P45, 9.5 wide on 18"
here is a picture of my wheels, but the dont do justice as they are black :)
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/4641/dsc0367i.jpg
Ilie
have you tried pulling the tiens in as far as the go on the top hat?
Edit AND can you take a pic of how hard they hit when mounted? (show the space still left at the hub)
mb7050
03-02-2011, 02:21 PM
pix from the insides showing your shock clearance etc?
pics .275/35/19 goodyear eagle f1 asymmetric tires
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/4923/imag0190e.jpg
http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/4352/imag0193.jpg
note that these tires have rim protection lip so they stick out a bit more than tires that have no rim protection .
you can see it in this pic.
http://img576.imageshack.us/img576/6682/65514025.jpg
Spyder
03-02-2011, 03:02 PM
When I had my rims put on the guys tried to fit the 18x10 +42 on the front with a 255 tire and it was hitting the stock struck, a +35 would clear it barely.
mmmm interesting thanks for the pictures!
When I had my rims put on the guys tried to fit the 18x10 +42 on the front with a 255 tire and it was hitting the stock struck, a +35 would clear it barely.
that's pretty much what i'd expect. as i pointed out with mb7050, +42 on 9.5" or 10" is just not going to fly with the stock struts. kinda wish i'd gone with +35 or +32 on mine. oh well.
GTOJOE
03-02-2011, 07:00 PM
pics .275/35/19 goodyear eagle f1 asymmetric tires
What are those tyres like? When I was buying a read many reviews and the most comprehensive was by Wheels Magaine in Australia and the yrated those as the best tyre available [that didn;t cost $1000+ each] and 2nd was the Falken FK452. I eneded up buyign the Falkens cus the Goodyear were $650.00 each and the Falkens were only $310.00 each and they were only 0.5% behind the Goodyear in the tests and better in the wet.
where did you get falkens for only $310? that's cheap assss
I'm looking at FALKEN 285/35R19 FK452 99Y but I suspect I'll be $400+ per tyre
GTOJOE
03-02-2011, 09:10 PM
From Highway tyre in Dandenong. $310.00 fitted and balanced.
ok I got quoted $335 each (285/35R19) 99Y...awesome :)
GTOJOE
03-02-2011, 09:29 PM
245?255?265? :d?
245/35/19
stealthTT
03-03-2011, 06:38 PM
285 on all four corners :)
thats big !!
about the pictures of the 10.5 wheels in the front. I dont have any pictures, as I tried to get some but it was tight and you couldnt tell from them. dont know when its going to be next time but if you really want I can try do it next days.
my suspension is set right now a little over the middle, on the interior. there are a few more cm left to pull the Teins inside, but I remembered that the wheels where hitting hard.
.
a lot of great info's on this thread.
Thanks DG !!!!
Ilie
please try..I'm keen to see how it goes....as I may in a few years look at 10.5 wide :p loads of pix would be fantastic! if you feel like pulling the teins in a bit and then adjusting the shock to knuckle as far out as it'll go that would be very educational as well.
FWIW my rims are due in on the 9th... I probably won't be back home till a few days after that.
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00358.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00359.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00360.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00361.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00362.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00363.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00364.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00365.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00366.JPG
2fnloud
03-16-2011, 11:12 PM
nice, can not wait to see them on your car.
mb7050
03-16-2011, 11:21 PM
hope they fit, looking good .
CoopKill
03-16-2011, 11:43 PM
OMG those a huge!
GTOJOE
03-17-2011, 06:03 AM
have you test fitted them yet?
2fnloud
03-17-2011, 08:21 AM
Are they 42 offset all the way around?
Fingers crossed, was hoping to fit them last night buuuuuuut other things happened ;(
with Tyres (yes I know not very exciting) these are the 285/35R19 99Y for $335
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00368.JPG
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00369.JPG
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00370.JPG
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00371.JPG
then I got bored...and had a camry handy
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00372.JPG
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00372.JPG
http://www.3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00374.JPG
sometime this evening I'll start fitting and see how it all goes! of other news the mounting surface has very deep bolt holes, so I'm tipping if i want more offset then I can just have the surface ground down (the surface has a marking to say +42 (than another saying +48...so I take that to mean that +48 is the maximum you can take off them).
And yes they are +42 all round, after I get them fitted and see how far they stick out I'll grab the XYZ rally shocks, see how much space I have with them then possibly get the offset moved to the correct +46 (for balanced bearings)
2fnloud
03-17-2011, 05:31 PM
How will you move the offset?
machine more off the mounting surface should be able to change +42 into +46, or if you put a spacer on (evil) you can go the other way not sure what will happen spoke wise...my big brake kit sticks out LESS far than the stock brakes and these wheels have a spoke design that sticks out quite far allowing a large amount of brake caliper space.....sooo yeah we'll see!
2fnloud
03-17-2011, 05:40 PM
that is how I thought. you have TIEN flex on right now correct?
yeppers, which works...but in huge bumps it transfers the force to the chassis which is BAD! :p so I'm looking at the rally shocks that have far more travel (should be somthing around the same as stock)
2fnloud
03-17-2011, 05:55 PM
I was hoping you was still stock strut. But this all makes sense now, I didn't think there was a way to fit a rim that wide with a stock strut unless it was sticking uber beyond the fender.
I think you could still use the stock strut if you went 18x10 but with a low profile to clear the strut more, I'm just hoping to replicate the stock struts in a different thinner package...guess we'll see what happens :p
pretty sure you'd be pushing it to try and run greater offset than about +32 on a 10" wide rim with stock front suspension.
2fnloud
03-17-2011, 08:36 PM
Then you get like what 14mm sticking out of the fenders?
something like that. i'm too lazy to run the math. 14mm isn't bad though. you'd be amazed what you can disguise with just some simple modifications. when i bought my car, it had rubber trims around the fenders. you'd be very surprised how effective this is in helping "smooth over" protruding tires.
do you have pictures of it?
http://www.3sgto.org/members/inperfectdarkness/albums/ipd-s-pile-crap/2398-pict0982.jpg
picture doesn't really show it. i didn't think i'd like them when i first got the car. the one on the driver's rear was coming off; so i pulled it. looks kinda bare without it. dunno. imho, it really works with the tires that stick out.
interesting...thanks for the heads up!
sure thing. it's extremely subtle. not sure how much they'd run, but i'm sure you can probably copy that look for ~$30 or less (USD).
Nationalmilkman
03-18-2011, 01:33 AM
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/0baf498a.jpg
18x10 +22 offset with 295/30/18 on front
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/ffb06378.jpg
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/5f5d1847.jpg
pretty much what mine looks like.
Race tires....
Be ready for front hubs to become a maintainence item with that much tire and offset. The front hubs on my DSM would last about a season before fatigue cracks would start propagating.
I always kept a spare pair on the truck. Not a bad idea for you either.
DG
Got any far away shots of the whole car, just to see it from a different perspective?
They fit!!
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00417.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00419.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00420.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00421.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00422.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00423.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00425.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00435.JPG
I have the same god damn issue that GTOX has with his wheels in that my 24mm wide nuts would not fit in the 23mm size holes ;(
I also believe that the lower shock mount is at the limit of it's positive camber adjustment and that the wheel is still very very negative camber so there is likely to be even more clearance with that (at the moment there is around 5mm of clearance)
also the outter dimension of the XYZ coil over is 85mm while the Tein shock one is 94mm SO that will allow even more clearance!
anyway tomorrow I'll hit supercheap or repco for some nuts and see what we end up with.
Race tires....
Be ready for front hubs to become a maintainence item with that much tire and offset. The front hubs on my DSM would last about a season before fatigue cracks would start propagating.
I always kept a spare pair on the truck. Not a bad idea for you either.
DG
yeahhhh :| my left hand one has already started to go bad and the current wheels are only +38 (or the old ones now)
Still gotta try these rims on the back...could be more interesting!
GTOJOE
03-18-2011, 06:46 AM
I bought my nuts from Repco. Paid $2 each. Retail price wil be about $2.50 each. Now you understand what I was talking about hahaha. My old nuts would fit but the socket/wheel brace would not. Mine are by "Nice Products" and the part number is J332-20 for a pack of 20 [just J332 for individual nuts]
Look in the lock nuts section. I didn't buy the key for them I just bought a 12mm bit for a 1/2 breaker bar.
http://www.niceproducts.com.au/download/Wheel%20Studs%20and%20Nuts_Oct10.pdf
I have the same god damn issue that GTOX has with his wheels in that my 24mm wide nuts would not fit in the 23mm size holes ;(
Although it wasn't me that had the problem with my wheels, i'm flattered you though my nuts were big :P
Post up some more pics when you fit the rears yeah, and i'm glad you haven't had any major fitment issues yet (touch wood).
2fnloud
03-18-2011, 08:09 AM
Race tires....
Be ready for front hubs to become a maintainence item with that much tire and offset. The front hubs on my DSM would last about a season before fatigue cracks would start propagating.
I always kept a spare pair on the truck. Not a bad idea for you either.
DG
So too wide of a tire can cause hubs to fail? I always thought it was the lack of proper amount of tire under the car that caused a hub to fail.
Nationalmilkman
03-18-2011, 09:27 AM
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/e8ef6853.jpg
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/b325eb33.jpg
I was just playing with the 10" on front. This is my 18x9/10 set up.
So too wide of a tire can cause hubs to fail? I always thought it was the lack of proper amount of tire under the car that caused a hub to fail.
this.
i don't know why so much crap is spread about hubs failing. my n/a hubs were fine (bearings and all) for 3 years of daliy use (and those were OEM to the car, 12 years old at that point). the tt-hubs i've got now are also doing just fine (swapped to 2g tt brakes).
my setup has just as much tire inside the well as stock. maybe if i went with a -60 offset or something bizarre like that, it would effect the hubs. i've yet to hear of anyone running 275's+ who has had issues with their hubs. supercar of all people would probably have been the first to chime in if this was a real issue. i don't abuse my car on a track like he does, and with 315's....i'm sure if there was a problem to be had, he would have found it.
2fnloud
03-18-2011, 10:38 AM
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/e8ef6853.jpg
http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb427/nationalmilkman/b325eb33.jpg
I was just playing with the 10" on front. This is my 18x9/10 set up.
Those are 10" that you tried up front and you put the 9" in the rear?
Nationalmilkman
03-18-2011, 10:49 AM
Sorry I made that confusing. The earlier pictures I posted with the tires sticking out 1.75" were the 10" on front. I knew people had been asking what they looked like. The second set of pictures are 9s front/10s rear
So too wide of a tire can cause hubs to fail? I always thought it was the lack of proper amount of tire under the car that caused a hub to fail.
It's more of an issue with race tires and a car driven at the limit, but yes.
The wider the tire and the larger the offset (ie outboard) the longer the lever arm on the hub. The longer the lever, the more force the hub has to resist and the more fatigue.
The 2G DSM front hub has a distinct stress raiser in it and racing fatigued the hell out of the hub. Stress cracks would start at the raiser and would propegate through the hub. Eventually it would completely shear. If you were lucky, the axle retaining nut would hold the wheel on. If you were unlucky, it would snap the end of the axle off too.
I broke two, one of which took out an axle. Fedja broke a couple too. Shortly thereafter, I took the hint and changed them twice a season, no questions asked. I added up the number of minutes on each hub that broke, divided that in half, and changed the hubs whenever they had that much run time on them.
I did the same thing with transmissions too. Parts used on race cars have short service lives.
The problem exists on wide tires used on the street as well, in that you are feeding more load through the hub. The degree is far less though, as you aren't cornering at the limit really at all, and if you are, the limits are far less than on race tires. Keep in mind that my DSM would see 1.7G transients and would happily sustain 1.3G. You won't get anywhere near that on street rubber.
So yes, shorter service life on the street compared to a narrower tire, but nowhere near as drastically as the race tire.
More worrying for street use is the tire sticking out proud of the fender. You'd be surpised how much crap will be flung off those wheels. Drive on a gravel road, or in the rain, and shit will fly everywhere.
The other side effect of super-wide tires is that the tires are wider than the typical rut depressions you find on heavily travelled roads (like I-94 in Detroit) The thing will tramline down the rut like an SOB and is really just annoying to drive.
There really isn't any need to go wider than about a 265 on a street car. With decent tires that'll produce tons of grip with limits really very high, but they'll still fit inside the fenders and they won't tramline too badly. Anything more than that is really trading function for fashion.
Race car, different story. Race car you stuff as much tire in as you can and live with the tradeoffs.
DG
2fnloud
03-18-2011, 11:38 AM
Dg thank you for that insite. There is no way I want 1.75" of tire sticking out beyond my fenders. Flush would be fine.
imho, if i can break all 4 loose, there's room to go wider. i'll let you know how it goes with 285's once i'm putting down 500+whp.
Don't go wider, go stickier.
Sticky trumps wide. A 205 race tire will outgrip a 335 rock.
DG
that would be fine....if i didn't mind replacing tires on my daily driver every year at ~$800 per set.
i'll stick to 285 all seasons. and no, i don't use my car off the street enough to justify having second set of rims/tires.
2fnloud
03-18-2011, 04:41 PM
Even a Summer Ultra Performance should last you more than one year.
Even a Summer Ultra Performance should last you more than one year.
i'm not about to start making compromises on my car. i believe in its existence embodied in the letters "GTO". i won't run brakes that i can only use on the track. i won't run tires that i can only run on the dragstrip. i want to be able to drive it in all conditions, everywhere, at any point in time. i'm willing to sacrifice some performance to achieve this. that's why i run all seasons. that's why my suspension isn't rock-hard. that's why i'm looking for a new, quieter exhaust. lots of people run summer tires. good for them. i still want to be able to drive my car in the snow; even if i never do. it DOES snow here in georgia on occasion. i've also taken my old 275 all-seasons through indiana winter snowstorms.
if your car is a weekend warrior; great, more power to you. get the slicks. mine gets driven every damn day. rain or shine. sleet or snow. windy or calm. i plan to keep it as "universal application" as possible. it's the same reason why people walk around with multi-tools in their jean pockets.
2fnloud
03-18-2011, 05:06 PM
i'm not about to start making compromises on my car. i believe in its existence embodied in the letters "GTO". i won't run brakes that i can only use on the track. i won't run tires that i can only run on the dragstrip. i want to be able to drive it in all conditions, everywhere, at any point in time. i'm willing to sacrifice some performance to achieve this. that's why i run all seasons. that's why my suspension isn't rock-hard. that's why i'm looking for a new, quieter exhaust. lots of people run summer tires. good for them. i still want to be able to drive my car in the snow; even if i never do. it DOES snow here in georgia on occasion. i've also taken my old 275 all-seasons through indiana winter snowstorms.
if your car is a weekend warrior; great, more power to you. get the slicks. mine gets driven every damn day. rain or shine. sleet or snow. windy or calm. i plan to keep it as "universal application" as possible. it's the same reason why people walk around with multi-tools in their jean pockets.
Reading fails me.
but if I had to drive my 3s in the winter, I wouldn't want the widest tire I can find.
no...and if i lived in michigan, i'd just go out and buy 4 doughnuts for winter use. :)
p.s.
does anyone know where i can buy another tt doughnut tire? mine's nearly completely dry rotted.
that would be fine....if i didn't mind replacing tires on my daily driver every year at ~$800 per set.
i'm not about to start making compromises on my car. i believe in its existence embodied in the letters "GTO".
Hrm. Contradiction right there.
Once you start cranking the power up, you start making compromises. Car won't hook up? Put sticky tires on. Don't want to spend the money? Then learn to live with never hooking up or dial the power back.
I have built tons of race cars and high-powered street cars. Cheap. Fast. Comfortable. Pick two.
DG
i choose fast & comfortable. still doesn't mean i have to replace tires every year.
I bought my nuts from Repco. Paid $2 each. Retail price wil be about $2.50 each. Now you understand what I was talking about hahaha. My old nuts would fit but the socket/wheel brace would not. Mine are by "Nice Products" and the part number is J332-20 for a pack of 20 [just J332 for individual nuts]
Look in the lock nuts section. I didn't buy the key for them I just bought a 12mm bit for a 1/2 breaker bar.
http://www.niceproducts.com.au/download/Wheel%20Studs%20and%20Nuts_Oct10.pdf
Although it wasn't me that had the problem with my wheels, i'm flattered you though my nuts were big :P
Post up some more pics when you fit the rears yeah, and i'm glad you haven't had any major fitment issues yet (touch wood).
Shit sorry guys!!
yeah going to pop down to repco or supercheap and see what they have (with my caliper) and see what will fit
of other news these wheels have so much brake clearance it's crazy...the brakes could stick out another 1-2" and have shitloads of room
ahhh ok, sweet stuff, these wheels seriously fit amazing...almost to the point of me considering 10.5" wide's...but there would probably be no point (show me a rim that comes in 19x10.5 or 19x11+~44-48?) keeping it short it's great that so much research and days of measuring and stuffing around is paying off!
ok, the if's and butts.
1, the driver side hub seems to sit out 5mm more than the left..could just be allignement(this is a GTO so pass side for you americans)..also did you americans know that you guys are in theory in a dissadvantage in this car as it was designed to have the driver on the right hand side? :p would be keen to see some corner weights and see how true that JDM theory is.
2, I'm not exactly sure how things will end up alignment wise, but there is something like 7-10mm of room depending on how you adjust the lower cleave, this will probably make the difference as to how flush the top of the wheels fit with the fender, when I was fitting the wheels the pass side wheel was soooo perfect...the actual tread of the tyre was INSIDE the fender...the actual edge of the rim probably 2-3mm outside it...amazing stuff and I assume that the compressing of the suspension will bring the wheel back into the well (but I guess we'll find out!)
3, I need to get the annoying wheel nuts that actually fit with an allen key style fitting, my problem with these is I am forever seeing them get burred and rounded so I kinda want impact nuts...finding impact nuts? well...so far impossible, anyone got any help on this?
SOOo on with the show.
Quick few shots showing that a 380mm brake kit will fit on the car, the template is from a Ksport kit.
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00441.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00440.JPG
the driver side fitted, it's a bit deceptive, the tread of the tyre is actually around 2-3mm outside the guard, I'm pretty sure the hub has a bit of positive camber though (I just pulled it out at the cleave mount as far as it would go)
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00443.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00444.JPG
on the ground:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00450.JPG
Pass side, key with this one is I did not bother adjusting the cleave Just bolted it on, to my surprise the tyre diden't even rub on this...must be close to the spring though...1-2mm I'd assume, so I just pulled the top of the shock right in and left it.
Before pulling the shock in.
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00445.JPG
After:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00453.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00454.JPG
Showing the side profile:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00451.JPG
Rear fitment, thought it'd be way out, but after fitment it's also surprisingly good!
since I can't afford more rubber for a month I shoved them on one side:p
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00463.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00464.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00466.JPG
heaps of room :p
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00467.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00468.JPG
final glory shots..yes it's 4x4 spec...might bring the rear down slighly... dunno at this stage:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00470.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00471.JPG
GTOJOE
03-19-2011, 01:47 AM
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00441.JPG
I hope you don't drink that shit!!!
lol nah someone else in the apartment block :p I just cut it up :)
I found some wheel nuts I actually like :)
M12x1.5 - Conical, Hardened Steel Racing Lug Nuts (http://www.race-studs.com/servlet/the-34/M12x1.5--dsh--Conical%2C-Hardened/Detail)
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/Nuts.jpg
my 17mm socket is 23mm in diameter and will just fit into the wheel holes, so these are perfect :p (in theory) now if I could just get them and matching studs in titanium :p :p
GTOJOE
03-19-2011, 03:04 AM
yeah I looked for 17mm nuts for that same reason but no-one in town had any. Infact no-one had anything so had to order overnight with repco.
Those worked out pretty well. Good work.
DG
still fighting for Lug nuts :p
OB MUTEKI LUG NUTS ACURA HONDA 12X1.5 M12 1.5 BLACK (eBay item 180538820599 end time 25-Mar-11 07:12:54 AEDST) : eBay Motors (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/OB-MUTEKI-LUG-NUTS-ACURA-HONDA-12X1-5-M12-1-5-BLACK-/180538820599?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a08f3c7f7)
20 x for $100
1/2" Black Bulge Acorn Lug Nuts 17mm Hex 20 Lugs 4642T (eBay item 250740106414 end time 08-Apr-11 22:57:06 AEST) : eBay Motors (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/1-2-Black-Bulge-Acorn-Lug-Nuts-17mm-Hex-20-Lugs-4642T-/250740106414?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a614664ae)
20 x for $30?
guess we'll try then and see what happens :| I'm fully expecting the last mob to take forever to get back to me.
and Lastly exactly what I'm after...just a bit too long (make them 20mm instead of 40mm long and I'd buy them in a flash)
http://www.evasivemotorsports.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=EVS-W-001&Category_Code=L1
20 x for $255 (not inc postage) ouch..but titanium yum
of other news these wheels have so much brake clearance it's crazy...the brakes could stick out another 1-2" and have shitloads of room
So you're ditching the K-sports for these yeah :p
http://i648.photobucket.com/albums/uu203/timmm36/7101525a.jpg
Actually no! the plan is in a year or so to just upgrade to the latest version of the Ksport 380mm brake kit, I've been spending a fair amount of time talking to some Ksport guru's and I now have quite a lot of faith that their kit is damn good! (this is from a distributor)
so more or less this:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Brakes/Ksport380m/380-400-1.jpg
I liked the look of the Tarox but they cost STUPID money (like 6k Aus, while the Ksport is HALF that)
Urk.
Brakes: Wilwood (acceptable) AP, Alcon (awesome) Brembo (good) Stoptech (slightly overpriced but convenient because they do all their homework and the stuff fits and works - you're paying for the R&D)
K Sport I wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole.
I had Wilwood on my car and they did the job. Subsequent cars I used AP.
http://www.apracing.com/drawings/p12106.pdf
Beware cheap parts. A lower initial price is almost always a false economy. Wait a little longer and do it right the first time, rather than get the cheap stuff up front and have to do it twice.
DG
the Ksport calipers are copies of the AP Racing ones, it works just fine :) pretty impressed with the awesome stuff the guys in the UK have been doing with Ksport Kits.
I've been running them for 3 years now, massive upgrade from stock and the only issue I've had was the first set of rotors.
there have been lots of bad things said about Brembo kits, it's almost a swear word in Australia now.
i don't know that i'd trust those tarox rotors. they just look like there's so little material there; they couldn't possibly be an effective heatsink.
not trying to be offensive to you or anything, but those Tarox brakes are meant to be shit hot the Tarox 12 400 caliper is very light at 3.6kg, and takes up to a 405mm disk and 36mm thick (for stopping hummers from 250mile per hour lol) the Rotor that I believe is in that photo is actually a 380mmx34 mm version....
freaking nuts stuff.
check this thread:
GTOOC - GTO/3000GT Owners Club • View topic - Tarox 12 Pot Brakes (http://www.gtooc.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1388&p=10527#p10527)
by way of comparison the Ksport caliper is only 2.2kg....I'll take that weight saving thanks!! (unforutunatly Ksport rotors only up to 32mm thickness in 380mm diameter, but seriously if I'm screwing that up ....I don't know what! :p)
if my car only saw track days, those might be the ticket. since i don't plan on running my brakes at an operating temperature of 1500 F, i think i'll just stick to heftier rotors.
you think you can find rotors that weigh more than those? I'm confused where do you think material is missing from? the center hub?
partly. i understand the benefits of a 2-piece hub. i also know that it reduces the ability of a rotor to function as a heatsink.
stealthTT
03-22-2011, 07:49 PM
here in my country a lot of peoples are using these brakes. most of them told me that they are the same as ksport & d2racing.
have you ever heard of these??
they have bbk kits for 3000GT :)
XYZ Auto Parts (http://www.xyz-racing.com/brakekit1.php)
http://www.xyz-racing.com/images/f286303.jpg
They have started selling in Aus, I assume it's the same Taiwan factory that makes them all...
I've not had a problem with my ksport other than the origional Rotor...generally the pads they ship them with are crap, I'd get Ksport instead frankly as I've tried and tested them.
my next upgrade will be to a larger set of Ksports.
here in my country a lot of peoples are using these brakes. most of them told me that they are the same as ksport & d2racing.
have you ever heard of these??
they have bbk kits for 3000GT :)
XYZ Auto Parts (http://www.xyz-racing.com/brakekit1.php)
http://www.xyz-racing.com/images/f286303.jpg
they'd have to have a pretty killer price for me to opt for those over stoptechs. if i'm going to put red brake calipers on my car; i've got a LOT of options. hell, i'd probably go for baer > everything else.
last I checked they were very very cheap.
stealthTT
03-23-2011, 06:52 AM
a front kit 286mm x 26 mm - which is smaller than we have, but to give you a clue about the price, 890 eur with a 6 pistons calliper.
also they go up to 400mm discs and 8 pistons callipers, floating discs.
286x86 is scary...would not even bother changing the brakes before you go 356 or above (below that and honestly I suspect the stock brakes will be just as good with some good pads + SCE Wide rotor kit))
286x86 is scary...would not even bother changing the brakes before you go 356 or above (below that and honestly I suspect the stock brakes will be just as good with some good pads + SCE Wide rotor kit))
i second that. 330mm kits are just not enough of an upgrade over 2g tt brakes to be worth it, imho.
mendoza
03-23-2011, 11:56 PM
MR2 your ride looks great I love the wheel choice. I am currently running Axis Sevens 19x10's with a 275/30/19 tire with spacers on my 92 stealth tt stock struts and tein springs. Do you think the XXR's will clear the stock calibers on a 1st gen TT? To me they look damn close from the pics. My current rims are getting old the chrome is pitting and there is scratching on some of the rims. I'm on the edge not sure if i should try your setup and run my same tires and hope for the best or powder coat my rims. Any thoughts? Here are a few pics of my car.
http://inlinethumb50.webshots.com/46001/2977094140081416094S500x500Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2977094140081416094ocCblM)
http://inlinethumb42.webshots.com/6377/2952212180081416094S500x500Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2952212180081416094VnuNNG)
http://inlinethumb45.webshots.com/19500/2150111570081416094S500x500Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2150111570081416094PyiMbL)
if you can make a brake template (looks like the below link) aka get me the below measurements I'll make a template here and find out + pix
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Brakes/Ksport380m/MI09-7-Model.pdf
just get me the basic measurements (in that example I need to know the 38mm one and the 380-102(102mm) one.
2fnloud
03-24-2011, 12:39 AM
I love the axis seven rim, too bad it will not fit on a 2nd gen.
10.5" info.
Rubber:
looks like a 305/30R19 would fit perfectly...
Rims:
only bothering to look at stuff that's under $500 per rim and has SOME brake clearance+offset
a few JDM spec 19x10.5's are turning up...SSR Type C (22lbs, +45 offset, low cap clearance 27mm, high 37mm??)
http://www.upgrademotoring.com/wheels/ssr/ssr_type-c.htm
on special here:
http://www.c-red.com.au/specials/
http://www.nengun.com/tanabe/ssr-type-c-rs
305/30R19 is also a good size for fairly cheap tyres....mmmmmmm will measure up after the new suspension arrives ;)
I love the axis seven rim, too bad it will not fit on a 2nd gen.
why not? it's rather rare that an 18" rim that would fit over 1g tt brakes wouldn't fit over 2g tt brakes. there's usually more room the further away from the hub you go.
Still not received the nuts so I can't really beat the shit out of the car to see how the go, the old 19x8.5 + 245/40R19 Rubber were 24kg, the new rims are 12.5kg no rubber, + rubber they are 26.5kg (wow, so much rubber)
Last pix I swear (maybe)
all 4 are on.
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00515.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00516.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00521.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00529.JPG
Showing front clearance maybe 3-4mm total outside the fender.
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00524.JPG
weirdly one side of the car has 12mm outside fender...must be alignment...will take it in and see what happens, only place they rub is at full right lock on pass side fender (wha?)
how close to shocks you ask?
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00536.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00538.JPG
ok, yes I know a long time commming.
FINALLY I got the nuts to allow these wheels to be securely mounted, going to give the car a good bashing tomorrow arvo and see how it goes.
the nuts are Muteki Openended in black...20mm diameter to fit the annoying wheel nut holes...25g each yumm
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/Nuts/Muteki/DSC00867.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/Nuts/Muteki/DSC00869.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/Nuts/Muteki/DSC00870.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/Nuts/Muteki/DSC00873.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/Nuts/Muteki/DSC00877.JPG
Quality SEEMS good :p
if only they were all titanium, and I could get titanium studs....and chop some of the spare metal around the hub off :p could loose another kg off each wheel :p looking at the weights of things the stock 18x8 chromies are 14.5kg then you usually have 8-10kg of tyre bringing you up to 21 ish kg each rim, the 522's are 12.5kg + another 14kg of rubber :p bringing you up to 27kg ouch! oh well. probably added another 3kg ish to each wheel weight wise.
GTOJOE
04-27-2011, 06:08 AM
Light wheels aren't always good :p take my old wheels for example. Much lighter than my new ones..... but now full of cracks hahaha
yeahhh, I'm tempted to go back to 18's....guess we'll see how this pans out, I want to fully give this the through and through before disgarding it...especially as any 18" setup I go for is likely to weigh just as much :D
anyway took it for a quiet blurb through the burbs, and even though the tires look like they should really hit the guards after a good half an hour doing back streets and round abouts and all the usual rubbish (abait, not at my normal blat speed) there was not a single mark on any guards or wheels) the wheel nuts are so perfect it's not funny :) love them
Next step is to pretty much slowly increase my confidence in the traction etc and see how far we get before something becomes an issue, I'm very close to ordering the 3sx rear control arms to see if I can pull the rear wheels in more (as one is 5mm further out than the other wtf)
UPDATE TIME.
I've since had these on and gone for a few spirited drives and Ohhhhhh Boy FANTASTIC, HUGE improvement, where I'd usually be squealing and the front just going out on me it now just hooks, going from the 245/40 crap rubber to 285/35 good rubber is really outstanding, I rarely actually get the fronts to scrub anymore :D much to my amazement there is still no rubbing with the tyre catching any other part of the car other than the left side wheel touching the chassis rail (don't really have a fix for this one yet.)
if I can I'm going to grab a Gtech meter, going to throw the old tyres back in and do a certain bit of road, then the new and see what the difference is, MAY take a while though as I've put down a fair chunk of money for some very nice coil overs to replace the tein rubbish, so as soon as they arrive I'll update this again. (the DMS's may cause rubbing or other changes to my current setup)
lastly I've also found a combo of 18x11 that might fit, to this end I'm 99% sure i'll be sticking with the current brake setup, the 18x11 should allow the rubber to make LESS contact with the chassis rails and yet still be capable of taking 315 rubber mmmmm would need to chop guards + run flairs I think though.
GTOJOE
05-15-2011, 08:36 PM
UPDATE TIME.
I've since had these on and gone for a few spirited drives and Ohhhhhh Boy FANTASTIC, HUGE improvement, where I'd usually be squealing and the front just going out on me it now just hooks, going from the 245/40 crap rubber to 285/35 good rubber is really outstanding, I rarely actually get the fronts to scrub anymore :D much to my amazement there is still no rubbing with the tyre catching any other part of the car other than the left side wheel touching the chassis rail (don't really have a fix for this one yet.)
It's amazing going from cheap crap tyres to good quality ones. Yours would feel even better due to the increased surface area on the road but even changing just the rubber and staying the same size was a massive improvement for me. No squeeling or anything which my old tyres did ALL the time. I push them very hard and still have not found the limit. The front does understeer when pushed very hard in tight corners but that is expected in our cars.
UPDATE TIME.
I've since had these on and gone for a few spirited drives and Ohhhhhh Boy FANTASTIC, HUGE improvement, where I'd usually be squealing and the front just going out on me it now just hooks, going from the 245/40 crap rubber to 285/35 good rubber is really outstanding, I rarely actually get the fronts to scrub anymore :D much to my amazement there is still no rubbing with the tyre catching any other part of the car other than the left side wheel touching the chassis rail (don't really have a fix for this one yet.)
if I can I'm going to grab a Gtech meter, going to throw the old tyres back in and do a certain bit of road, then the new and see what the difference is, MAY take a while though as I've put down a fair chunk of money for some very nice coil overs to replace the tein rubbish, so as soon as they arrive I'll update this again. (the DMS's may cause rubbing or other changes to my current setup)
lastly I've also found a combo of 18x11 that might fit, to this end I'm 99% sure i'll be sticking with the current brake setup, the 18x11 should allow the rubber to make LESS contact with the chassis rails and yet still be capable of taking 315 rubber mmmmm would need to chop guards + run flairs I think though.
i'd love 315's. :D only problem is, 18x11 rim selection is limited...and i'm not even sure if i'd find one that fits the brakes AND has a look that appeals to me.
but you're absolutely right, wider makes a LOT of difference. i love my 285's; and it's a NIGHT AND DAY difference from the 225's i started with.
yeah brake clearance is a good question on the high offsets, oh well, will revisit the idea at the end of the year :)
2fnloud
05-15-2011, 10:44 PM
Rear fitment, thought it'd be way out, but after fitment it's also surprisingly good!
since I can't afford more rubber for a month I shoved them on one side:p
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00463.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00464.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00466.JPG
heaps of room :p
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00467.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00468.JPG
final glory shots..yes it's 4x4 spec...might bring the rear down slighly... dunno at this stage:
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00470.JPG
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Rims/XXR%20522/DSC00471.JPG
What struts are you using those don't look like the Tiens
rear is stock, front is Teins.
going DMS on the front, the back really seems fine and I cannot find a reason to swap them....considering the amount of other things I can do for the amount DMS want for rear shocks :p
2fnloud
05-15-2011, 11:06 PM
that brake template, is that the stock brakes or an after market brakes?
aftermarket, the Stock ones stick out further (40mm the ksport I run are 30 or 34 or something)
yeah brake clearance is a good question on the high offsets, oh well, will revisit the idea at the end of the year :)
well the offset shouldn't matter....unless spoke design changes with offset (some are like this, fnorks...for instance).
there's GOING to be some bulge with 11" width; so the problem would still be how to flare the fenders accordingly. all of the "widebody" solutions out there still suck, imho.
well, I saw a STI that actually looked good with flares the other day...so i'm even re-thinking it :p oh well.
flares CAN look good; the trick is to make it work with the stock lines. and the "riveted-on" look only works for 4x4's.
for a 3/s, the fronts are straightforward and fairly simple. the trick is to get the rears to look OEM without making it look like blubber hanging off the car (or making the car look like it has love-handles).
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs794.ash1/168421_1648229099968_1664185648_1467806_6218307_n. jpg
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1387.snc4/163907_1648229979990_1664185648_1467808_6065248_n. jpg
taken from Karlton's 06 SGM STI - Full Race-Custom Fender Flares! 18x11 test fit o_0 - Page 43 - Subaru Impreza WRX STI Forums: IWSTI.com (http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gd-members-journals/182281-karltons-06-sgm-sti-full-race-custom-fender-flares-18x11-test-fit-o_0-a-43.html)
I know it's not everyone's cup of Tea, but I think that looks amazing :)
I think fenders like that on your car would look tough as.
Judging by the reaction I keep getting to my Sig Photoshop it would be uber :D
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Flares/murderedoutgto.jpg
hopefully someone does it :)
couse I'd buy them!
Judging by the reaction I keep getting to my Sig Photoshop it would be uber :D
http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Flares/murderedoutgto.jpg
hopefully someone does it :)
couse I'd buy them!
those fender flares on that photoshop looks amazingly good. (like I've already told you in pm) :)
all the other wider fenders I've seen on 3000gt's has looked like crap.
all the other chops are in here:
Index of /car/Misc/Flares (http://3000gt.com.au/car/Misc/Flares/)
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