Oil filter options

[Mean Green]

What options do we have other than what the dealer specifies?

All oil filters for our cars have a pressure release valve that opens around 15psi and allows un-filtered oil to pass. Now, are cars do have an M20 - 1.5 filter fitting and it is the same as many Porsche's / Nissan's. Most of Porsche's pressure relief valves do not open until 32 psi...yes, some models run a dual filter setup where as others do not but still...other very high performance models run a very large filter. Also, a side note, many other high performance vehicles run filters that are on par with the Porsche's until you get into serious exotics...then you run into multi-filtration systems that are replaceable element filters like the Canton's.

The reason I am thinking about this is out of all the 6G engine's I have torn down to salvage cranks from...the ones that are damaged all look the same, every damn one of them. They all look like the bearings have been washed out from debri. Simple stuff really, it is as if the smallest containment got into the engine and caused a domino effect. Some are worse than others but I am not talking about 200k engines here, I am talking about engines with less than 100k on them, now to me, that is a very short life time and bearings should not even show premature wear unless proper maintenance was not performed or debri did get into the engine.

Just some comparison's:

Our filter: 7-9 GPM, Cellulose filter, 3.1" tall, 12-15 PSI pressure relief valve.

Porsche filter: 9-11 GPM, Cellulose filter, 5.8" tall, 32 PSI pressure relief valve.

Nissan GTR filter: 7-9 GPM, Cellulose filter, 3.4" tall, 14-18 PSI pressure relief valve.

Mazda RX7 filter: 7-9 GPM, Cellulose Filter, 3.4" tall, 14-18 PSI pressure relief valve.

The only problem with the Porsche filters are that they are around 20$ a pop at your everyday parts store. I want to know what every else's opinion is on this...I know a few people that run Canton's and love them and others who have hated them but without a real explanation. Now what I want to know is what filter do you run if you do not run a stock filter?




Please, lets not get into this brand is better than that one..etc..etc..I don't give 2 shits what brand is better than what as the higher in performance the car is, the less selection of brands you have to choose from.

[Mean Green]

So everyone uses the stock oil filter setup?...

[Austin@STM]

All i have ever run is an OEM filter, thats what we use on every car we do.

[Unknownvr4]

I have been running a wix filter on mine... not sure of the pressure relief and stuff like that are on it

[Mean Green]

The brand does not change the pressure relief as it is specific to the car. Now, if you change the specific part to say one of the ones I specified, then it would change.

I just think it weird that I've taken apart around 50 or so 6G72's and probably around 30 6G74's in salvage yards in wrecked condition. Almost all of them had less than 100k on them and none of them had over 150km. I just thought it to be really weird that with such low mileage, these engines had so much wear and tear on them in comparison to other engines with more miles. The only conclusion I can possibly come up with is that the oil filtration system is not efficient enough to help sustain the longevity of the 6G series engine's. The weakest part that can be easy changed out is the oil filter....sooo I start there...I guess I kinda expected more people to have thought the same thing or run something other than the OEM filter.

[Unknownvr4]

Interested in answers..

[Mean Green]

Interested in answers..

If I keep my car, I am going to use the same system as the 97 911TT, its a dual filter system...

or

I'll just use a Canton system.

[RL7]

Interesting idea. Do you think the debris actually comes from the filter and doesn't originate from the bearing itself? Definitely worth a shot.

[Mean Green]

From the look of it, it seems like a foreign piece of debri or a local piece of debri gets in or past the filter. I can normally find, in most, a ring that has been dug around a main bearing and then it makes it to one of the rod bearings. From there is seems that the small amount of bearing material just recirculates and washes the rest of the bearings out over time.

[KeithMac]

Would be interested in seeing what you come up with as a replacement!, could you not crush the top of the filter to adjust the bypass spring load (like people do with BOVs and FPR to adjust the pre-load); haven`t looked into it personally.

I`ve seen too many bad pictures of the Cantons to use one myself would rather stay stock.

From what I`ve seen the bypass valve should only open if the pressure differencial between the 2 sides of the filter is over 1 bar, how often does it open?.

[Mean Green]

I find it hard to believe that the Canton filters are that bad. They are used in almost all exotic cars, well, not the Canton brand but almost the exact same style, a replaceable element filter.

[green-lantern]

If I keep my car, I am going to use the same system as the 97 911TT, its a dual filter system...

or

I'll just use a Canton system.

I wouldn't use the Canton. I just spent the day with Ray Pampena and some other friends at the Dyno. He doesn't seem to recommend them. I believe they just aren't compatible with the 6g72 and can cause insufficient oil pressure/flow. I can tell you one thing, never ever use a fram. Saw the results 1st hand today. Just order some stock ones, they are proven. That's what Ray recommended. I'll be ordering some tomorrow.

Edit: BTW if you can't get a stock one I think he said purolator was good.

[mb7050]

good thoughts

how about K&N thats what I´m using ?

[blindmist]

Purlator PureONE

[Mean Green]

good thoughts

how about K&N thats what I´m using ?

When you get into brands, it's all about the efficiency rating. Purolator has a 99.9% efficiency rating at catching things above 11-15 microns, 97.5% efficiency below 15 microns and 50% efficiency at 5 microns. Less efficient filters most likely trap little below 15 microns.

From all the data I can find, so far, as far as brands are concerned the order goes like this:

1. Amsoil

2. WIX

3. Mobile 1
↑↓these 2 have pretty much the same exact specs.
4. Pure 1 (Purolator)

5. K&N

6. Others and below.


The above is just based on brands and data based on the brand. What I am after is a filter that gives more capacity basically. The more filter area you have, the best chance at catching things. Like I have stated before, I am after a reason that causes the 6G series engines to fail prematurely as it does not make logical sense for an engine to fail at such a young age when engines of its same style last twice as long. Everyone with a 3000GT knows how rare it is for a 3000GT to surpass 170km without an engine issue, I cannot name a single one though they do exist. Now the only logical explanation for this, that I can find, is that the oiling system has a slight fault and in comparison to other cars filters and filter specs, ours are below almost all other cars.

[blindmist]

When you get into brands, it's all about the efficiency rating. Purolator has a 99.9% efficiency rating at catching things above 11-15 microns, 97.5% efficiency below 15 microns and 50% efficiency at 5 microns. Less efficient filters most likely trap little below 15 microns.

From all the data I can find, so far, as far as brands are concerned the order goes like this:

1. Amsoil

2. WIX

3. Mobile 1
↑↓these 2 have pretty much the same exact specs.
4. Pure 1 (Purolator)

5. K&N

6. Others and below.


The above is just based on brands and data based on the brand. What I am after is a filter that gives more capacity basically. The more filter area you have, the best chance at catching things. Like I have stated before, I am after a reason that causes the 6G series engines to fail prematurely as it does not make logical sense for an engine to fail at such a young age when engines of its same style last twice as long. Everyone with a 3000GT knows how rare it is for a 3000GT to surpass 170km without an engine issue, I cannot name a single one though they do exist. Now the only logical explanation for this, that I can find, is that the oiling system has a slight fault and in comparison to other cars filters and filter specs, ours are below almost all other cars.

I use Amsoil 10w30 Full Synthetic with a Purlator PureONE and have had the best results ever. Great oil pressure and always clean oil. I used Amsoil Filter before the Purlator PureONE, and the oil would be black as could be. With the PureONE, it still has an amber color to it at the change of 9000 miles on the Amsoil.

[Drweldin]

I've always been interested in a remote dual filter set up. Probably not all that hard to make from Jegs or Summit parts...then you have dual filtration AND can use what ever filter(s) you want.

[mb7050]

I have always wondered why our oil filter is so god damn small..

[RL7]

This is where my filter currently resides:
http://i432.photobucket.com/albums/qq49/rlyons7/11222009263.jpg

I suppose you could do something similar and put pretty much anything in it's place. I have an oil-cooler in-line before the filter, so if it were to clog for some reason, my engine would be screwed. This seems like a pretty unlikely event though.

Oh- that junk fram filter was only on there to prime and "rinse" the engine.

[Patryn]

Went with a canton oil filter myself. I liked the idea of the oil not bypassing the filtered. Oil pressure seemed to improve at idle.

[KeithMac]

They work perfectly well until the filter medium colapses.. If you see how the bike manufacturers mount the replacement celulose filters it`s a world apart from how Canton does it..

[green-lantern]

Went with a canton oil filter myself. I liked the idea of the oil not bypassing the filtered. Oil pressure seemed to improve at idle.

Get rid of it! trust me.

[Mean Green]

If the Canton filters are crap, then why do almost ALL exotic cars run that style filter?

Look up a Ford GT oil filter for example. They are also used in many race cars. The problem to me is that there is not enough surface area and the element becomes clogged and collapses. Well, if that's the case, run a larger one. They make remote units which are the ones used in race applications.

[Patryn]

What other alternatives are there as far as high end oil filters that filter all the time?

[MR2]

Of the Ryco Filters I found that were similar..

66mm Seal
Z56B
Z456
Z312

those above would fit and are longer, the problem is the seal, it needs to be the right diameter.

[green-lantern]

If the Canton filters are crap, then why do almost ALL exotic cars run that style filter?

Look up a Ford GT oil filter for example. They are also used in many race cars. The problem to me is that there is not enough surface area and the element becomes clogged and collapses. Well, if that's the case, run a larger one. They make remote units which are the ones used in race applications.

Well whats good for the goose isn't always good for the gander. Just because a filter is efficient in removing particulates doesn't mean it's good for oil circulation. The more efficient the filter the harder it is to draw through. Some engines work fine with certain parts and some don't because of one reason or another. I've seen the ends fall off of these filters because the glue they use. I cant share others pics or info without their consent but I'll see if I cant get somebody to weigh in on this.

[Patryn]

Should be some threads on 3SI that still have the picks up of a partially collapsed filter and of the glue situation. However in my case I have not seen either happen upon inspecting the filters when changing oil or replacing the filter. It could be problematic if the filter starts to become blocked from trapped particles and higher rpms causing it to collapse. Maybe the larger filters would have faired better. Anyone have any definitive analysis or comparison of the canton filters? I've been searching around on the internet, but nothing other than a few posts here and there come up.

[green-lantern]

Should be some threads on 3SI that still have the picks up of a partially collapsed filter and of the glue situation. However in my case I have not seen either happen upon inspecting the filters when changing oil or replacing the filter. It could be problematic if the filter starts to become blocked from trapped particles and higher rpms causing it to collapse. Maybe the larger filters would have faired better. Anyone have any definitive analysis or comparison of the canton filters? I've been searching around on the internet, but nothing other than a few posts here and there come up.

I think you are about spot on. I believe a larger filter would work much better. With a higher eff you need more filter to improve flow. Higher eff filters obviously become clogged sooner so they would be more prone to collapse or find alternate routes (leaks).

[Mean Green]

I think you are about spot on. I believe a larger filter would work much better. With a higher eff you need more filter to improve flow. Higher eff filters obviously become clogged sooner so they would be more prone to collapse of find alternate routes (leaks).

Exactly. That's why I feel that our oil filtration system is inadequate. As I stated above, in comparison to other cars that are like ours, our cars have the lowest spec filter, its the smallest, lowest pressure relief spec, smallest surface area, hell...my damn lawnmower has a bigger oil filter than the 3000GT.

[green-lantern]

Exactly. That's why I feel that our oil filtration system is inadequate. As I stated above, in comparison to other cars that are like ours, our cars have the lowest spec filter, its the smallest, lowest pressure relief spec, smallest surface area, hell...my damn lawnmower has a bigger oil filter than the 3000GT.

You might be able to find an alternative with an adapter of some sort but the canton offered now I just wouldn't trust. Personally I'm only going to run Mitsu or in a pinch purolator from now on but stock is getting harder to find. Finding a good worthy alternative could cost you an engine or two in research and development. I'm definitely not trying to be negative, this is a good topic that should be addressed.

[Mean Green]

You might be able to find an alternative with an adapter of some sort but the canton offered now I just wouldn't trust. Personally I'm only going to run Mitsu or in a pinch purolator from now on but stock is getting harder to find. Finding a good worthy alternative could cost you an engine or two in research and development. I'm definitely not trying to be negative, this is a good topic that should be addressed.

The good units are the ones that are remote. Like this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120617668938&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT

[MR2]

yeah I second the remote thing, just one big arse remote would make me happy, and then I'd like one that's cleanable...but with the cleanable ones I've yet to do any research...sooo yeah

[green-lantern]

yeah I second the remote thing, just one big arse remote would make me happy, and then I'd like one that's cleanable...but with the cleanable ones I've yet to do any research...sooo yeah

I'm still paranoid of big changes from stock. These engines are so temperamental. If that filter caused a restriction by a 90 degree angle in the external line it could cause an engine to fail.

[MR2]

yeah, I always go tapered 90's...did that for my entire oil cooler install and seemed to gain a fair amount of oil pressure from it too.

the Nascar things look interesting but I wonder if they really give that much filter surface area than the OEM thing....would be more keen to go something truck style :| anyone got some expert suggestions on the filter side of things? problem with nascar is they only have to last so long...you want something good for 10,000km no worries.

[Lugnut]

k+n filters .. 14.00 at Auto Zone .. Sorry IDK the relief pressure rating .. I do know Matt from DR recommended them to me as one of the strongest filters on the market for our cars ..

[MaxClass]

Remembered reading something about the new Royal Purple filters some time back.

Found their website on the filters and it has an interesting manufacturing video that you can watch too.

http://www.royalpurple.com/rp-oil-filter.html

They use a different type of filter element with a screen backing for strength and it appears extra attention to details. Don't know they cost but might be worth looking into.

Have never used one nor know anyone who has so the jury is still out here.

[Unknownvr4]

Bump this thread TTT

[Street_Chally73]

I've ran Wix, OEM & my most recent one is Purolator's PureONE. I'm still testing them out to see which one yields the cleanest oil, but judging by what others have experienced I will most likely be sticking with the Purolator one.

+1 for an interesting topic.

[donniekak]

I think some people don't understand how the bypass works. If you have a 15psi bypass, it doesn't mean that when your oil pressure is over 15psi it is going arouond the filter. It meas it opens when the pressure differential across the filter is 15psi. This prevents you from having 3psi of oil pressure with an old filter at idle.

[green-lantern]

k+n filters .. 14.00 at Auto Zone .. Sorry IDK the relief pressure rating .. I do know Matt from DR recommended them to me as one of the strongest filters on the market for our cars ..

I’ve wondered about the K&N filters. I really don’t care how much they cost (within reason). I just want the best protection without choking off the oil supply.

[Mr Faust]

I've been using K and N on both my cars, no oil related issues yet.

[Unknownvr4]

Looks like im going to have to choose between k and n and a pure one

[GTOJOE]

Subscribed.

[RL7]

This wasn't a "what brand of oil filter do you use" thread, the OP was trying to discuss alternative and possibly improved oil filtration systems. Kindly try to refrain from chiming in with which brand of oil filter you like.

[RL7]

double post.. database error

[green-lantern]

This wasn't a "what brand oil filter do you use" thread, the OP was trying to discuss alternative and possibly improved oil filtration systems. Kindly try to refrain from chiming in with which brand of oil filter you like.

Chill dude, it's "oil filter options" whatever is best for the car, stock, K&N, fram, jacksquat, remote or none it should be talked about in this thread. Not to mention OP just sold his car so....

[RL7]

Chill dude, it's "oil filter options" whatever is best for the car, stock, K&N, fram, jacksquat, remote or none it should be talked about in this thread. Not to mention OP just sold his car so....

I wasn't upset or trying to attack anyone or anything like that. I just thought the op had an interesting idea that goes a little farther than oil filter brand preference. That, and the smaller print in very first post says specifically that he is not trying to talk about different brands.

The effectiveness of different filter brands is a good topic of discussion, but it would probably be better suited for a different thread.

[Adam7]

Ive been using the "x" brand oil filter for about 4 years now and my oil stays amazingly clean. I change the oil every 3k miles no matter what, but I would say I could probably go a few thousand more.
We have used this brand for few different cars and seems to be the best at filtration.

[brutten]

FYI - K&N and Mobile 1 are the same filter.

If you go to www.bobistheoilguy.com you can spend weeks reading about oil filters and the tests they do on them.

[R/T93]

FYI - K&N and Mobile 1 are the same filter.

If you go to www.bobistheoilguy.com you can spend weeks reading about oil filters and the tests they do on them.


Yep, open up the boxes, look inside, the same exact markings on the internals, only difference is the casing, the K&N has the nut to help removal.

[MR2]

Yep, open up the boxes, look inside, the same exact markings on the internals, only difference is the casing, the K&N has the nut to help removal.

I thought the picture in your Sig was you with an Afro till I realised it was a helmet :p

[R/T93]

I thought the picture in your Sig was you with an Afro till I realised it was a helmet :p

Dude that would be sweet if I could grow an afro with a sun visor!! lol