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View Full Version : What input sensors does the ECU read in closed loop vs open loop? Stutter/no power



Keyan
10-01-2013, 02:31 PM
My car has been developing this issue recently. And it has been getting progressively worse as the weeks wear on.

Cold start up, when attempting to drive the vehicle, it will sputter and cough and not produce any power. 5% throttle or WOT makes no difference.. At exactly 3,000rpms POOF the issue is gone and the car accelerates like it should!

It used to be a slight miss under 3,000 but it is at the point now where throttle input does nothing until that magical 3,000rpm mark where it clears up. Almost like an on/off switch. Can barely accelerate and the Wideband shows super lean (AKA lean misfires) After about a minute of doing it the car will be fine and not do it any more at any rpm.

It also does it some times during warm starts but won't do it for as long (maybe only once)


I am very sure it is electronics related due to it magically clearing up above 3,000rpm. but I can't figure out what it could be.

It's not the TPS (tested ok, but swapped it out anyway. problem persists)
It's not the ECS ECU. (unplugged it, problem persists)
Coils ohm fine and do not arc with water test.
Plugs new.
Wires new.
I have an HKS DLI and the problem persists with it both pluged in and unplugged.

The computer also likes to throw a constant P0300. If I clear it, it will come back in 2 drive cycles, even when this problem I am posting about doesn't happen. I am running aftermarket o2 sensors, which according to a thread on 3SI will cause the p0300, so I considering replacing them with OEM new.

Nothing really looks wrong in my logs (ie, coolant sensor and such seem ok) but I can provide that if I am needed to.

What should I look at next? Replace the o2 sensors? Or maybe the PTU?

Greg E
10-01-2013, 03:26 PM
Do your narrowbands cycle at idle/cruise?

If not (which I'm guessing they don't) is the front bank showing max rich and the rear bank showing max lean?

Unplug the narrowbands and reset the ECU or disable Bit 2 in periphery 0 and reflash. Tell me what happens.

Keyan
10-01-2013, 07:54 PM
with the o2s unplugged the problem goes away. the car idles at a good AFR but cruising is at 13.1AFR and lower.

Greg E
10-01-2013, 09:24 PM
I bet your O2 inputs are swapped.

Keyan
10-01-2013, 10:18 PM
they were swapped when i first got the ecu, and the car wouldnt run at all. remember you called me? i had the first 1st gen jester ecu

i have been running the car for months and this issue has only cropped up a few weeks ago.

Greg E
10-01-2013, 10:23 PM
No I didn't remember.

If that's not the case then there is either something wrong with the sensors themselves or the chassy ground m

Keyan
10-08-2013, 07:18 AM
Drove my car yesterday and did some logging.

The front bank low fuel trim is maxed out at 12.5%.
The rear bank is -1%.

you may be right about a grounding issue because my ecu reports the battery voltage to be pretty low. Cold start up around 13.1 and when the car is fully warmed up only shows like 12.6-12.9. (I have swapped alternators and the ecu still reports these numbers.)
I need to physically check the voltage at the alternator to confirm whether or not the ecu is reporting the correct voltage or not (which may hint to a ecu grounding issue)

Here is the log, if anyone is wanting to look at it. if you watch wideband scaled after the car is moving, you can see the issue happen at least 2 times (when it goes 18+AFR)
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BxXvnQJNC-9iV3M1Sjl1RVU5bnc/edit?usp=sharing
File was set public so anyone should be able to grab it.

Greg E
10-08-2013, 09:37 AM
Front bank needing more fuel could be a number of things.

Intake leak (lower front manifold gasket)
Cracked front header
Blown turbo exhaust gaskets or lose turbo bolts
Bad front o2 sensor
Dirty/clogged front fuel injectors

Keyan
10-31-2013, 11:25 AM
Fixed the lean miss during warmup. One of the o2 sensors was bad. Heater circuit died so it would send false readings to the ecu at light throttle causing car to miss badly.
Replacing both o2s fixed it. I am guessing the ECU would have noticed the issue but I had the heater codes disabled because I only have pre-cat sensors (gen1) ;)

Greg E
10-31-2013, 11:49 AM
Good news! Glad you got if figured out.